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Topic: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE (Read 1236 times) |
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pappa
Full Member
VM Diesel 2.5Tdi 90kW
Posts: 259
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24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« on: Nov 6th, 2006, 1:10pm » |
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Hi everyone.
I managed to purchase a NEW 2.3 DOHC Engine and there is a
A4LDE autobox attached to it. This is an amazing package,
A genuine NEW Ford engine + autobox, with all the sensors,
oil cooler, starter motor, selector mechanism, wiring, ecu etc.
attached to it. I'm in heaven...
Anyway, I drive a 24V which has seen roughly 200 thousand
kilometers. It has not been treated as good as it should have
been, but I'm slowly getting it working and running well.
I'm now looking into replacing the autobox with the new
one I've purchased. Some people are talking about 24V's
having a strengthened autobox. Is this true or just another
urban legend? If so, has anyone experience on how the
2.3 A4LDE would behave under the load of 24V 207bhp?
The torque difference is quite a lot in these machines.
That's a quite a task to do, so it would not be nice to
see it blow into pieces at the very first test run
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My cars are the best and the pigs and cows fly.
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TiberiuS
Senior Member
Ex. 1996 2.3 Ultima - RIP P789 KHJ
 
Posts: 2257
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #1 on: Nov 6th, 2006, 4:19pm » |
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Extra torque of the 24v will burn out the 16v box although they are both the same type. The A4 used in the 24v has stronger bearings and some more plates I believe.
2.3 has 202nm of torque, 24v has 286nm. Not a hell of a difference but the box is weak enough with the torque from the 2.3 as it is, I wouldn't go there  .
Hope this helps.
Regards, Bruce.
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Bruce - '07 Jaguar XKR coupe, '95 Jaguar XJ Sport 4.0, '82 Ford Capri 2.0 Ghia, '15 Honda Civic (sloooooww..)
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Dave2302
Senior Member
2006 Mercedes S55 AMG, Retired Barefoot Waterskier
Posts: 1119
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #2 on: Nov 6th, 2006, 8:34pm » |
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Hi Pappa,
Can't remember exactly where but I've posted this one before. 
Too many differences to go into detail again; clutch stacks, thrust bearing design / type, OWC at rear end casing, bell housing, gearsets, servo sizes and so on.
Its a definite no no. 
The 2.3 Guts won't last 5 minutes assuming you succesfull transplant the front pump (bell)housing. This is not a nuts and bolts exercise as you need the correct tool to set the end float (selective thrust washer).
Regards,
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Dave "The 'ol Bear" ex Footer !
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pappa
Full Member
VM Diesel 2.5Tdi 90kW
Posts: 259
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #3 on: Nov 6th, 2006, 9:17pm » |
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Wow!
I take a deep bow and thank you gentlemen! You saved me a lot of time
and money, based on these facts, I'm not going to do it.
Thank you.
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My cars are the best and the pigs and cows fly.
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Dave2302
Senior Member
2006 Mercedes S55 AMG, Retired Barefoot Waterskier
Posts: 1119
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #4 on: Nov 7th, 2006, 8:46am » |
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Hi Pappa,
No Problem, A good idea may be to try and exchange the unit you have with someone on here who may have a good low mileage 24v Unit, but need a 2.3 box. Just a thought,
Cheers,
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Dave "The 'ol Bear" ex Footer !
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Dave2302
Senior Member
2006 Mercedes S55 AMG, Retired Barefoot Waterskier
Posts: 1119
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #5 on: Nov 7th, 2006, 9:05am » |
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By the way just an informative note to all, re transmision I.D. 
The "A4LD" was never fitted to the Scorpio, it is the original 4 speed + lock up transmission fitted in Granada's and Sierras, except the 2.0 Twin Cam units, (see below). It is fully hydraulic in its operation in all 4 gears, oil pressure is hydraulic controlled with vacuum modulation. Some had electronic module controlled lock up and some hydraulic (mostly the Diesels).
The A4LD - E is actually the unit fitted to the 12V Scorpio and very early 24V Scorpio, and also with different bell housing / guts, was fitted in the old 2.0 twin cam Granada. This is hydraulic operation in the first 3 gears, and has hydraulic oil pressure control with vacuum modulation. It has electronic module controlled 4th gear and lock up.
The unit fitted to most Scorpios is actually designated the "4R44E" which is totally electronically controlled in all gears and lock up and also has electronic pressure control via pulse width modulation. They are under almost full control of the powertrain control module, (P.C.M.)
Obviously then some have different pump (bell) housings, and some have different torque capacities which is governed by clutch pack stack up, gearset strength and bearing / thrust washer differences, amongst other.
Hope this clafiries the transmission identification a little,
Regards
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Dave "The 'ol Bear" ex Footer !
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pappa
Full Member
VM Diesel 2.5Tdi 90kW
Posts: 259
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #6 on: Nov 8th, 2006, 8:06am » |
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on Nov 7th, 2006, 8:46am, Dave2302 wrote:Hi Pappa,
No Problem, A good idea may be to try and exchange the unit you have with someone on here who may have a good low mileage 24v Unit, but need a 2.3 box. Just a thought,
Cheers, |
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Thanks for the tip Dave. I live in Finland, so swapping
boxes with you guys in U.K. could be a little challenging
I appreciate your advice, thank you very much.
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My cars are the best and the pigs and cows fly.
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howiedintheplace
Senior Member
Based near Evesham
Posts: 1194
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #7 on: Nov 8th, 2006, 10:24am » |
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Not a good idea to use a 2.3 box behind a 24V.
It would not simply just blow up but over a farily short period of time would simply wear out.
Mainly due to overheating which is a auto's worst nightmare 
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Dave
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pappa
Full Member
VM Diesel 2.5Tdi 90kW
Posts: 259
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Re: 24V A4LDE Autobox replacement with 16V A4LDE
« Reply #8 on: Nov 12th, 2006, 12:54pm » |
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The remorse has been growing and growing...
I have re-thinked this 24V to 16V downgrading and would
probably like to stick with the 24V after all... 
My main concern is that my A4LDe might be failing, I'm not sure, but
it's just a feeling. Sometimes up change is jumpy and the gear thuds
in and definately I feel the 3 or 4 gear slipping a little too much (it's
3, I'm fairly sure of it) . It's not missing gears or anything like that
and it's working... but these little things have made me uneasy. I
would not like it to blow up when my wife is driving it.
The oil is brownish, even though it has been changed 3 months ago
( filter too ).
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My cars are the best and the pigs and cows fly.
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