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Topic: Relay next to gear box? (Read 430 times) |
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Relay next to gear box?
« on: May 16th, 2006, 11:20am » |
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Hello.
Some of you might remember that I've had some problems with an intermittent non-starter.
I'm still trying to find the exact problem, but it is definately temperature dependant, but it also seems dependant on battery voltage, as weird as it may seem. Although the battery is fairly new, I plan on swapping it for a stronger varta (or similar good brand) battery when I can afford one.
To the point. Often when it doesn't start, when I turn the key, I can hear the clicking of a relay located somewhere near the gear box. Does anyone know if there is supposed to be a relay there, and what function it serves? It gives an audible click every time I turn the ignition to "start".
Also, where is the starter located? (2.0 16v).
I've searched high and low without any luck. I've seen sketches of it, but can't find anything which resembles it.
Was thinking of checking the connections to the starter, as they may be part of the problem.
Kjetil
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Matt
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Manual'd and a 4.0 in the making
Posts: 2816
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #1 on: May 16th, 2006, 9:05pm » |
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hey
does your car have the seat warmers? if it does there is a relay next to the handbreak (under the plasitc center console), it may be that clicking in and out if you have an electrical short somewhere
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #2 on: May 16th, 2006, 10:59pm » |
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Yes, it has seat warmers. Both work perfectly, I used them yesterday, but perhaps I should, take a peek beneath the cover anyway. Haven't studied the cover much, is it difficult to remove? (I got the regular cover, not the version with the arm rest)
Thanks
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sector-9
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No scorpio anymore
Posts: 1069
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #3 on: May 17th, 2006, 12:11am » |
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If it's a very loud and rapid clicking then it's probably the solenoid on the starter motor. This is often caused by insufficient battery power (there's enough to close the solenoid but that switches the starter into circuit and the current drawn then drops the voltage so low that the solenoid opens and the cycle repeats). Sometimes the battery is so low that the solenoid doesn't close completely and you just get a single loud click when you turn to pos III and another when you release the key. This can also indicate an open-circuit starter motor.
If I'm correct then that also gives you a clue where abouts the starter is - wherever the clicking is coming from!
Darren
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #4 on: May 17th, 2006, 1:23am » |
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I can hear the starter clicking from time to time (single loud click), before it dies. Other times it's just nothing. Unless I'm starting to loose my hearing, the relay sound comes from a different direction 
Wonder if it's the passenger switch which is playing up. Tonight I had to wiggle it a bit to get the heat on. The drivers side switch works perfectly.
My first plan of action was to locate the starter and check the connections. I believe I read a Ford memo once about poor connectors on the early models (mine is october 94!), and that a revised version was available.
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Tompion
Administrator
1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
Posts: 2918
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #5 on: May 17th, 2006, 1:34am » |
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Could be a bad earth, next time it happens try connecting a jump lead from the battery to a good earth on the engine.
Dave
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ABS multiplug wheel sensor pins MK IV or MK 20
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #7 on: May 18th, 2006, 11:04am » |
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It did the non start-thingie again today, and I tried connecting a jump lead from the battery to the front lifting point on the engine, and it started on first attempt, the "problem" is that it started again when I removed the jump lead. So now I really can't be sure if it started because of the jump lead and then fixed itself (as usual), or if it just fixed itself.
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Tompion
Administrator
1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #8 on: May 18th, 2006, 12:00pm » |
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Kjetil
It could be that.
The reason I suggested it was I had a car (not a scorpio) that every now and then wouldn’t start. It would usually go if I poked around under the bonnet. Over the course of a few months I changed the battery & the starter, checked the wiring etc. one day it happened again, but when I got it going the accelerator wouldn’t work – turned out the throttle cable had been sharing the earth & got so hot it melted the plastic lining. The fault was the crimp on one of the terminals on the earth strap. I silver soldered it on & never had the problem again.
A simple meter test won’t show this sort of fault, it has to be under load.
Try feeling the terminals of the earth strap to see if they get warm.
Dave
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #9 on: May 18th, 2006, 4:31pm » |
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Now it did it again, but this time the jumper cable trick didn't help at all. All I can hear now is the (heater?) relay clicking.
Anyone know how to remove the center console plastic? Can't find it on the site.
And where is that starter 
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meg
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #10 on: May 18th, 2006, 5:02pm » |
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hi kjetil s-starter is as your looking into engine bay on the LHS at the rear under the oil filter,should be able to see it from above.but easier to check conectors etc from below.you can see it here but not very clear. page 4 http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/manualtrans/MT75DOHC8V.pdf (copyright ford)
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Snoopy
Administrator
Very old.BAD tempered and missing friends.
Posts: 6278
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #11 on: May 18th, 2006, 5:18pm » |
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The centre consul Trim is held in with screws there are two at the front one either side of the gear lever (Where there is a "join")
the centre trim around the gear lever just lifts out but be careful not to break the plastic pins there are two more screws under there and then some under the centre arm rest. If you need pictures of the trim removed I can post some to you. the whole thing then slides forward off the brake lever.
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #12 on: May 18th, 2006, 6:54pm » |
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Thanks alot, will probably have a look at it tomorrow. It rains too much right now (when doesn't it?)
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Kjetil S
Senior Member
2001 BMW 520iat
Posts: 1419
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #13 on: May 26th, 2006, 1:17pm » |
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Still haven't had time to locate the starter or the heated seats relay, but I HAVE possibly had a slight break through.
Suddenly got the idea of checking the alarm and immobilizer, so I did some googling and found the schematics for my aftermarket alarm system, located the immobilizer connections (it sits between the ignition and starter). I then disconnected the alarm multiplug and put a short wire between the immobilizer connectors in the multiplug.
Turned the key, and presto: it started. With the alarm still connected, it was dead.
It would seem like the alarm is overheating or something when the car is running, so it won't turn the immobilizer off.
I will do some more testing over the next days to verify that the problem is fixed, but it would seem so.
Also seems like a new DEFA alarm system is creeping up the shopping list for this summer 
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Dave
Senior Member
Tourmallard 24v (ex-owner)
Posts: 1984
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Re: Relay next to gear box?
« Reply #14 on: May 26th, 2006, 2:46pm » |
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You wouldn't be the first to have trouble with aftermarket alarm/immobiliser systems on a Scorpio, thats for sure 
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