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Topic: difficult cold starting scorpio (Read 3028 times) |
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MARK_HARLOCK
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difficult cold starting scorpio
« on: Mar 5th, 2009, 12:54pm » |
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Hi Everyone
Im a new member, My name is Mark. I am most impressed with the Scorpio site and have found it to be very helpful. I will be donating a sum shortly
I have recently aquired a Scorpio estate 2.3,Ultima 1998 S reg. Its a great looking car. I bought it for the huge load area it has.
The scorpio has very recently had a new headgasket, brand new from Ford inlet manifold, new thermostat. New crank sensor, new battery.
The scorpio basically runs very well and everything seems to work well, but I do find it difficult to start when its cold, you have to keep pumping the throttle, it will then fire up after several turns of the engine. No fault codes found when scanned. Im thinking a fuel problem. Poss fuel pressure reg?? I have a used one to try, due to a new one not being readily available locally. Has anyone got any Ideas??
Any thoughts/advice would be very much appriecited.
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scorpio_man
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Ford Kuga awd
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #1 on: Mar 5th, 2009, 1:08pm » |
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hi there
have you done the basic checks? sparkplug gaps/condition, air/vac leaks, etc.
hth
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Jonnycab
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Former owner of 2.3 Ultima Facelift saloon
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #2 on: Mar 5th, 2009, 2:04pm » |
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A faulty fuel pressure regulator can be known to cause this problem when engine is both hot or cold. I once had the same problem, but only when the engine was hot & that was down to the fuel pressure regulator 
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gozz
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Been around awhile
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #3 on: Mar 5th, 2009, 7:48pm » |
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Mark.
No amount of throttle pumping will make any difference to a car with fuel injection,however,if excess fuel is being injected,holding the accelerator to the floor may well clear it out.
GOZZ.
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MARK_HARLOCK
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #4 on: Mar 5th, 2009, 10:48pm » |
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Many thanks for your thoughts chaps. All the basic checks have been done. Its now at my mates garage for him to look at. Will post the outcome in due course.
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Snoopy
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #5 on: Mar 7th, 2009, 7:13am » |
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I would suspect coils and/or plugs and leads if it difficult to start first thing .
Difficult starting when HOT is as JC states most likely down to faulty fuel regulator.
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #6 on: Mar 7th, 2009, 7:50am » |
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My 2.9 12 valve hates cold weather, has done since I bought her 3 and a half years ago. She lives outside and playes up every time we get a cold spell otherwise she is a great car and performs perfectly. I have no idea what this moodiness is about but I stopped worrying about it about 2 years ago. I would still llike to cure this though.
Mike N
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Snoopy
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #7 on: Mar 7th, 2009, 9:20am » |
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Mike N. Difficult starting on the 12v is IMHO an easier one to cure. I had it on my 12v on occasions when it was outside in the damp and cold . My cure was a compete clean of all the High Voltage system and replace the leads and distributor cap and rotor arm at regular intervals... Try starting at night in the cold and looking under the bonnet . It is quite usual to see the cause if its High Voltage. A spray of WD 40 or similar water repellent spray helps for a short time . Please remember that the 12v still uses "old" technology for generating an ignition source. I did also think at one time of replacing the coil but cleaning cured the problem
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MARK_HARLOCK
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #8 on: Mar 7th, 2009, 1:42pm » |
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Thanks again chaps. willl replace plugs leads etc in due course, will post the outcome.
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #9 on: Mar 9th, 2009, 9:07am » |
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 Talk about putting ones foot in ones mouth. Having uttered my words of wisdom I decided to wash her. Well she did not want to start and then she fired up ok., moved her a few fee and gave her a good wash with the engine ticking over switched off , gave her a shammy off and moved her to her original place. No probs at all. Next a.m. I had a look in the boot to see if there had been any ingress of water after overnight storm, nope but lots of water coming out of the boot light cluster which is usual so I gave the boot a harder than usual slam closed, twice in fact. jumped in and turned the engine. My Bty is in excellent nick as proven by the ease with which the engine spun and spun, but no ignition. No smell of fuel either so I am going to investigate the cut off switch today, hopefully. Tried to reset it yesteday but no difference. So there I am . I will report later and thank you very much for all your advice Snoopy 
Mike N
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #10 on: Mar 9th, 2009, 3:12pm » |
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 All done, she's back on top form!! It was the fuel cut off switch in the Boot. I removed the cover, four Phillips screws, removed the unit, 2 Phillips screws and unplugged the unit, gave it a good squirt of Electric Contact Cleaner shook it all about, you can feel the ball bearing or whatever it is that makes the internal connections moving about, let it drain, re-set the red button by pressing it in, re connected the plug screwed the unit to the car, turned the iqnition and up she fired
With hindsight maybe I should have done this well before now.
I hope this helps
Mike N
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Snoopy
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #11 on: Mar 10th, 2009, 8:13am » |
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Thats what happens when you slam the boot shut ! Getting it s own back for the mistreatment 
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #12 on: Mar 11th, 2009, 8:35am » |
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Foot in mouth again  Thought, "I'll take her for a spin today " Engine just spun over as before  .. So I walked away in a huff. That was yesterday, so when I get 5mins I'll swap the cut out switch with one that I know works and report back folks.
Never a dull moment
Mike N
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Jonnycab
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Former owner of 2.3 Ultima Facelift saloon
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #13 on: Mar 11th, 2009, 9:17am » |
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Mike N, have you checked out the fuel pump relay ?
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Waglet
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Aubergine 24V
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #14 on: Mar 11th, 2009, 11:04am » |
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This sounds like the problem I have. Can you hear the fuel pump 'kick in'? The diagnosis on mine is unknown (wating Ford man to have a look at it next week). Unless you get "a real fix" and a definate part that is faulty you can never trust it can you? I've had 3 failures so far and the local garage has got it started but no "fix". I work for for BT and we call this "right when tested". No good to man or beast. The other terminology is FNF. (Fault not found) Worse than RWT (right when tested). FNF means there was a fault but it went away and we can't find what's wrong!
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Waglet
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #15 on: Mar 11th, 2009, 6:38pm » |
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I went to look around at things; Removed the Fuel cut off valve gave it a squirt of Contact cleaner, shook it all about, reconnected everything again to no avail. This was at dusk but I've discovered that the PATS light stays on on top of the Dashboard so I have completley disconnected the Bty and when about half an hour is up I will reconnect and see what happens
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #16 on: Mar 11th, 2009, 7:53pm » |
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 No difference - No loose sparks Packed up for the night. Back to the Drawing Board and all the points raised by The Brains Trust. That's you folks
Mike N
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #17 on: Mar 14th, 2009, 8:43am » |
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Yesterday I swapped over the Fuel Cut off Switch - No difference.
Swapped the Fuel Pump Relay - No difference.
Removed the Fuel Pipe from the top of the Fuel Pressure Regulator and spun the Engine - TAKE ALL PRECAUTIONS WHEN DOING THIS AS PETROL ONLY TAKES A SPARK TO IGNITE - some fuel came out of th Regulator and the engine coughed, I left her for about 10 mins and did the same with the same results.
Reconnected the fuel line and turned the Engine. She starded up like there had been nothing wrong.
A few mins. later I was talking with my neighbour who knows nothing about "cars"  . He asked if I had run the Petrol very low recently? No, but my son had my car up in York for a couple of weeks and told us how he had just managed to get to Tesco's petrol Station with the sound of the pump sucking out the last drops of Petrol  Clogged Fuel Filter I will renew it and see.
I'm still undecided.
She started this am without a hesitation
Mike N
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Tompion
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1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #18 on: Mar 14th, 2009, 10:07am » |
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on Mar 14th, 2009, 8:43am, Nunnspoet wrote:
Removed the Fuel Pipe from the top of the Fuel Pressure Regulator and spun the Engine Mike N |
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I don’t have a 12v does it have a direct connection (that’s removable) to the top of the Fuel Pressure Regulator?
Speaking for the 16v there isn’t a direct removable connection on the regulator apart from the vacuum pipe – which shouldn’t have petrol coming from it.
If you removed the feed line you should get petrol squirt out of it if the engine has been run recently as it should be under pressure.
If you remove the return line some petrol may come out – removing the filler cap may stop it if the tank has pressurised.
I don’t need to run the engine with a pipe off, I just need to turn the ignition on and the pump will run for 10 seconds & a significant amount of petrol will squirt out.
Dave
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Nunnspoet
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Re: difficult cold starting scorpio
« Reply #19 on: Mar 14th, 2009, 6:51pm » |
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Just checked and the fuel line I removed is the Fuel return line that sits on top of the Fuel Pressure Regulator. Sorry folks
Mike N
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