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Topic: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT* (Read 942 times) |
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Vandelen
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2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« on: May 10th, 2009, 9:21pm » |
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Hey Scorpio lovers,
I've got an 1996 Scorpio Estate with the 'new' 2.5 Tdi VM engine. I think it's lacking a lot of power, especially noticable when climbing a hill or bridge. I'm going to try to describe the problem as detailed as possible, so bear with me...
My car used to produce lots of smoke when reaching +/- 2000 revs, so when the Turbo should kick in. I traced that problem, being a leaking airtube to the Turbo inlet. I repaired it with tape, untill I can order a new tube tomorrow. Now it's producing white/greyish smoke, but not every single time. The car is now a bit faster, gains revs quicker beyond 2000 revs, but still I think it should be faster. I can't keep up with the 1996 Volkswagen Passat of my parents, which only has a 1.9 Tdi. So my 2.5 should be a bit quicker than this, no? (even if it isn't a 'true' Tdi, but still)
I always blamed the MAF, because on the outside both screws were broken of. That doesn't mean it's inner components should be failing, but at least it's a bad sign. According to my parts dealer, a new MAF costs me € 325 + VAT, so that kept me from replacing it right away.
Is there any way I can test my MAF with a multimeter? Which wires should I connect and what values should I mesure?
Are there any other possibilities I should check?
Thank you very much  !
EDIT: I conected the 2 outer wires of the MAF, number 1 and 4 (the black one and the white/blue) to a multimeter. I got stable readings of 7,6 Volts, independant of revs. Did I get the wrong wires, or is my MAF really defective? Even if this are the 'input' wires to provide current to the hot wire, it should be 12 Volts, no?
Best regards,
Lennert
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python9
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1997 24v ghia saloon
Posts: 241
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #1 on: May 11th, 2009, 1:01pm » |
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have checked the fuel filter when it chokes up you will get a real smokey motor then you will lose power you wont be able to start the car as this can cause some of your problems power wise as i own a tdi as well and i had something the same as you is the engine louder than normal sound and it wont rev very good if yes then its the fuel filter 2.99 from halfords and it should be quicker than a passat 1.9 the 2.5 tdi scorp is suprisingly very quick for a desiel
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k1ng_james
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #2 on: May 12th, 2009, 5:05pm » |
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I have the 2.5td vm engine. They are sluggish because the car weighs so much and the engine only produces 125bhp 
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scammell_tipper
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #3 on: May 12th, 2009, 5:37pm » |
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have you checked air filter
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Vandelen
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #4 on: May 12th, 2009, 8:50pm » |
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Thanks for the replies, guys!
I have checked the air filter, it is as clean as it should be. Have not yet had the time to check my fuel filter, so I'll set my hopes on that one.
I still think my MAF has broken down on me though. I whish I had a spare one laying around, so I could quickly check whether he is the villain. I guess I should take the leap, and buy a new one... After I checked my fuel filter of course 
Greetz,
Lennert
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Tompion
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1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #5 on: May 12th, 2009, 9:47pm » |
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Details of MAF output here:
http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/mafdata.htm
Does it run better with the MAF disconnected?
The price you quote seems rather high, search for one on ebay using the part number, you should get a second hand one fairly cheap.
Dave
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Vandelen
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #6 on: May 13th, 2009, 10:38am » |
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Thanks, Tompion!
I must have missed that page on the site. Thanks for pointing that one out, it's exactly what I needed.
When I disconnect the MAF, my car runs exactly the same. So I guess the connected MAF does not have any effect at all.
I've been searching for a new MAF for some time now, but up to now, I never found one on eBay. But I'll keep searching...
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scammell_tipper
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #7 on: May 13th, 2009, 2:21pm » |
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not familliar with the 2.5 tdi but white/greyish smoke & loss of power could be a timing problem ie to far retard, unburnt fuel is the smoke.i am not sure how you check this on this engine, in my day it was a spanner job ie adjust fuelpump timing regards
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python9
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1997 24v ghia saloon
Posts: 241
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #8 on: May 13th, 2009, 4:07pm » |
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the 2.5 tdi is not sluggish m8 your turbo must be knacked if its sluggish
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k1ng_james
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #9 on: May 13th, 2009, 7:06pm » |
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i also have a 206hdi which is only a 2.0td and it pulls far better than the scorpio which is a 2.5td. The vm engine is a work horse not a perfomance engine.
Something is a miss as the car is smoking. I would change the filter 1st, change fuel pipes for clear 1's to see if your getting air bubbles in the fuel this would also make you lose power and smoke 
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wojtekor
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #10 on: May 13th, 2009, 7:13pm » |
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like k1ng_james said... after all the Scorpio diesel is an old italian construction and they've never made a good diesel engine
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Vandelen
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #11 on: May 14th, 2009, 7:51pm » |
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True! I guess all modern diesels are faster than one of the ninetees. Especially Peugeot, known for their light bodyworks
Now back to my VM Italian Stallion
I got the new air tube for the turbo and installed it right away.
I also followed your advices and changed my fuel filter and put a genuine Bosch instead.
Unfortunately I can't say it solved all my problems. On the contrary, the black smoke has returned 
I can't really compare, but maybe the car is a bit faster now. But it's not a night-and-day difference. Next step... measuring the MAF, now I know the fuel filter is clean.
*EDIT* I ran a new test on the MAF. At idle I got a reading of 0,001 Volts on the MAF RTN. So I guess I can now officially declare my MAF to be dead... On to a new one...
Thank you guys for all the input!
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wumpster
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1996 2.5TD Scorpio Exec
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #12 on: May 15th, 2009, 1:40am » |
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black smoke no power could be the turbo m8 we get that on the mondeo taxis when the turbo is knakered or a blockage in the inter-cooler
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Vandelen
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Re: 2.5 Tdi - No power, but smoke *EDIT*
« Reply #13 on: May 30th, 2009, 8:38pm » |
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I found a brand new Bosch MAF (0 281 002 164) for 250 Euro, VAT incl. It did not seem a very bad deal.
Installed it right away and all the black smoke is gone now
I really notice the difference, it revs happier beyond 2000 and has more power in overtaking and such.
I still don't know if this is the fastest my Scorpio can go, but at least I don't gas the car behind me anymore
I'm going to run a few more test on the MAP for instance. Maybe some other things were wrong...
Thanks for all the help chaps!
Greetings from Belgium
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