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Topic: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!! (Read 4836 times) |
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Tompion
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1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #40 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 12:40pm » |
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Well, I couldn't on a 2.3 - although I would have been able to with the inlet manifold off - I tidied up the wire runs when I had the manifold off sometime later, there are some cable clips under there which I hadn't seen.
It's just the 2 plugs I mentioned earlier, so you could do a temporary join with the old wires into the new plugs until you can do it properly.
Just rembered you can't get the 2.3 manifold off without getting under the car 
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Brad
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #41 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 4:10pm » |
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Right then, I had a good look at replacing the loom and I'm very happy with all the connections apart from the 2 under the car.
I can just about grapple with the Crankshaft Position Sensor connection but there is no way I can get to the Oil Pressure Sensor connection. I can only just see where it is. I might be able to disconnect and reconnect the new one with long forceps but I'm puzzled as to how I can thread the new loom through to the connections.
Would it be possible to tie string to each connection and pull them through to the bonnet area, and then use the strings to pull the new loom through?
So close, yet so far.
Brad
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tootman318
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Leicester City Forever
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #43 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 6:07pm » |
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hi brad, if you dont mind me asking but how much was the new loom? ive just been quoted from fordparts uk for a 24v engine loom. about £530 delivered and from germany. i'm still on the floor in shock!!!!!!!! darren
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joe-satch
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joe satriani is the best guitarist in the world.
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #44 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 6:22pm » |
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tompion,i did manage to remove the inlet manifold from our daughters 2.3 when she had a water leak without going under the car...  .i was able to undo all nuts and bolts from the engine bay.and then replaced it the same way..mind you its got to come off again to replace the inlet manifold as i fear there is a crack in it..but the 'bars leaks' is holding for now... ..regards den. .ps and i have to repair the loom in the very near future...  .
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Brad
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #45 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 6:25pm » |
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on Jul 16th, 2009, 6:07pm, tootman318 wrote:| hi brad, if you dont mind me asking but how much was the new loom? ive just been quoted from fordparts uk for a 24v engine loom. about £530 delivered and from germany. i'm still on the floor in shock!!!!!!!! darren |
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Hi, I managed to get a new one fron the National Clearance Center who advertise on FleaBay. This one was £144.93.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA X:IT&item=360163205035
I don't know if they have one for a 24v though.
By the way, this loom is a NEW loom and has all the Ford stickers and finis number on. Therefore, I would say that the loom is a proper Ford item.
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #46 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 6:32pm » |
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still original loom even though it will be new will be poorly made... it's cheaper and better to rebuild the old one using new high class wiring...
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Brad
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #47 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 6:40pm » |
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Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team Brad, please check your private messages at the top of the screen.
regards
andrew
forum admin team
Until I can figure how to get the Oil Pressure sensor connection off and new one back on and thread the loom round the back of the altenator etc, I have taped the bare wires on the old loom with insulation tape.
One good think about that is that the car is now able to rev past 4500 revs which it didn't before.
I certainly don't want to cut the old loom and the new one to connect them just for the sake of one connection.
Meanwhile, rain has stopped play.
Brad
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pedropedro
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Posts: 677
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #48 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 7:34pm » |
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Not wishing to be contentious here, but ford redesigned the loom a few years ago.
They utilised new design high temperature insulation and that doesnt break down nor fail; it is a very well made loom . It is unlikely you could source wiring of the same spec and without question a new loom is the right option. Rewiring will not produce the same quality or reliability.
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #49 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 7:42pm » |
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on Jul 16th, 2009, 7:34pm, pedropedro wrote:| Not wishing to be contentious here, but ford redesigned the loom a few years ago. |
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can i ask for the source of this info? From what i know they didn't change anything.
on Jul 16th, 2009, 7:34pm, pedropedro wrote:| It is unlikely you could source wiring of the same spec and without question a new loom is the right option. Rewiring will not produce the same quality or reliability. |
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must disagree, these are very poor wires and of course you can source better ones... and rewiring done properly will give you better quality then the original loom and much much better reliability. and if you know what you're doing it will cost you much less the a Ford loom.
Maybe u misunderstood me, i'm not just talking about rewiring per se I'm basically talking about making a new loom yourself... And believe me when I say that it is not hard nor expensive to make a loom that is generally better then the original...
Let me rephrase that; I would never buy something I know will fail, even if it will fail after approx. 5-8 years, I would make it myself using better quality materials etc. so that I know it will last at least twice as long and cost less to make.
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pedropedro
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #50 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 7:56pm » |
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"If you find yourself in this situation and your vehicle was built before June 1996 we recommend that you examine the wiring looms in the engine bay. It will be of Arnitel and some insulation on the thin-walled control wires will have cracked in situ making the conductors prone to poor connection and/or damp. Post 6/96 cars are wired with Raychem44 and have presented no problems to date."
An extract from an article by Eric founder of the site.
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #51 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 8:01pm » |
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Aaaa you meant this redesign... Well the thing is that post 6/96 well made from better quality materials then the previous ones but still it was a much lower standard then for example BMW looms. And the still fail as time goes by.
My car was made with those redesigned looms and they still needed rebuilding. Point is, they sure last longer then the earlier ones but still it's way below expectations.
So like I said before they are not worth the money they are asking for them and you can source without a problem much much better wires to build a loom yourself for much less money.
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #52 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 8:10pm » |
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a bit of documentation on that matter:
Quote:It is unlikely you could source wiring of the same spec and without question a new loom is the right option. Rewiring will not produce the same quality or reliability.
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one more thing, don't know who told you that but the truth is that those looms use cheap wires, basically the same you can buy in ebay for a few quid, that no professional would use on a car due to very harsh conditions they have to work in. Good wires are quite expensive and you can't buy them on fleabay. But still when your doing things on your own it's cheaper then buying a Ford loom.
Ask any professional electrician who takes pride in his job and he'll tell you exactly the same.
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Brad
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #53 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 8:21pm » |
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That's all very well but I've already bought the loom and I can't afford any more expense, I'm skint. If the loom lasts another 5 years, then it would be worth while.
Brad
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pedropedro
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #54 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 8:24pm » |
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I too experienced exactly the same issues as you have with the loom and I am confident my nor your loom was made using raychem 44
My new loom has ben in the car for 4 years without any degradation at all ...not a hint of insulation damage
raychem 44 cable/sleeving meets a military spec MIL-W-81044 which is a very stringent spec. Anyway lets leave it alone bad for your health .
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #55 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 8:26pm » |
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on Jul 16th, 2009, 8:21pm, Brad wrote:That's all very well but I've already bought the loom and I can't afford any more expense, I'm skint. If the loom lasts another 5 years, then it would be worth while.
Brad
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Sure it will last quite some time and it will work fine. So you shouldn't worry.
It's just that they are not the best quality, but to be honest a new Ford loom will probably live longer then your car has to give... 
Only in my case I'm planning to keep my Scorpio forever as a collectable and I don't use it as a workhorse or something so a loom 'for just a few years' wasn't an option for me...
on Jul 16th, 2009, 8:24pm, pedropedro wrote:I too experienced exactly the same issues as you have with the loom and I am confident my nor your loom was made using raychem 44
My new loom has ben in the car for 4 years without any degradation at all ...not a hint of insulation damage
raychem 44 cable/sleeving meets a military spec MIL-W-81044 which is a very stringent spec. Anyway lets leave it alone bad for your health .
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well the proof of how good they are is visible on the pics 
Good that you don't have a problem with them though they are only 4 years old, let's just hope they will last another 4
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tootman318
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Leicester City Forever
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #56 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 9:30pm » |
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mine is a 97 built cossie estate and the engine loom is in tatters!!!!!! not touching it yet till i decide what to do. dont want to disturb anything
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #57 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 9:33pm » |
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Quote:| not touching it yet till i decide what to do. |
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if you have basic DIY skills, rebuild it...
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tootman318
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Leicester City Forever
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #58 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 9:45pm » |
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looks a mess at moment. but been looking closely and think if intake system was removed then access looks ok. are original connectors re-usable or not ?
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wojtekor
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Re: URGENT HELP PLEASE !!!!!!
« Reply #59 on: Jul 16th, 2009, 9:54pm » |
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well theoretically they are... although i'd recommend buying new ones, u can get them easily and they are cheap...
ps. rebuilding a cossie loom requires much more time and more then twice as much wire to do then a 16v but it's still doable if you can have the car sitting for a while...
i'd recommend getting another used loom to rebuild so you can keep the car going for this time on the loom it already has... then just swap them over...
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