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Topic: Cutting out when warm (Read 2206 times) |
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whentostop
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Cutting out when warm
« on: Oct 30th, 2013, 6:22pm » |
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It was all going so well. My 97 24v was behaving itself perfectly. Then one morning it reached operating temperature and cut out in the fast lane and coasted to a stop. Refused to restart. Next morning cold started as normal. Got warm them cut out. Starts fine every morning when completely cold. There is a spark. Feels like fuel starvation. The fuel pressure appears to be 3 bar when it first turns, but then goes to a dribble. I have substituted so far the coil pack, the fuel pump, the fuel pump relay, the fuel filter, the CPS, but I need some more / better ideas. Thanks.
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97 Black 24v Estate
97 Black 24v Saloon
94 Blue 24v Granada Estate
94 Blue 12v Granada Estate
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Matt
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Manual'd and a 4.0 in the making
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #1 on: Oct 30th, 2013, 6:58pm » |
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Sounds exactly the same as what alan had and it ended up having the engine loom rebuilt
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FDS2000 Scans - Birmingham
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Scorpio
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #2 on: Oct 30th, 2013, 7:34pm » |
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Have you scanned it to see any DTC's
Adam
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whentostop
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #3 on: Oct 30th, 2013, 8:02pm » |
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Just the usual O2 sensors it has always shown. If it was over rich wouldn't there be black plugs. Looked at the petrol return pipe and nothing there. If the regulator was faulty wouldn't there be fuel pressure in the return pipe?
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97 Black 24v Estate
97 Black 24v Saloon
94 Blue 24v Granada Estate
94 Blue 12v Granada Estate
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Scorpio
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #4 on: Oct 30th, 2013, 8:34pm » |
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With no codes. A tough nut to crack. As Matt has already said, check fuel loom integrity. Are you able to replica the fault whilst showing live data on OBD software.
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Nunnspoet
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #5 on: Oct 31st, 2013, 9:09am » |
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I seem to remember that years ago somethhing similar to this problem reared it's head. It may even have been dealt with in "simplelists". It turned out to be the Pressure Regulator.
As best as I can remember when cold the Regulator worked fine but as it warmed up something inside it stopped doing its job with the resulting fuel starvation - let the enging cool down and all would work as intended, untlill it warmed up again... Just like your Scorp.
Try swapping it over with one you know works before buying a new one.
Mike 
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Tompion
Administrator
1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
Posts: 2918
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #6 on: Oct 31st, 2013, 10:55am » |
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Mike
That was not restarting when hot whereas this is cutting out when hot.
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ABS multiplug wheel sensor pins MK IV or MK 20
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Tompion
Administrator
1997 2.3 Ultima estate.
Posts: 2918
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #7 on: Oct 31st, 2013, 11:09am » |
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on Oct 30th, 2013, 8:02pm, whentostop wrote:| Just the usual O2 sensors it has always shown. If it was over rich wouldn't there be black plugs. Looked at the petrol return pipe and nothing there. If the regulator was faulty wouldn't there be fuel pressure in the return pipe? |
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What do you mean by "Looked at the petrol return pipe and nothing there"
"If the regulator was faulty wouldn't there be fuel pressure in the return pipe?"
Pressure in the feed is built up between a valve in the pump and the valve in the pressure regulator. The pump delivers a lot more petrol than the engine requires the excess constantly returning to the tank, since there’s no valve in the return line there’s no reason for pressure to build up.
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ABS multiplug wheel sensor pins MK IV or MK 20
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Pegasus
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24V Cosworth Ultima Born: Sept 97, sold Aug 23
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #8 on: Oct 31st, 2013, 4:51pm » |
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Hi,
what are the LTFTs showing on the scan? I think they need to get to around +/- 15% before they trigger a DTC.
Mine used to occasionally stall shortly after starting a hot engine. No codes but LTFTs were around minus 10-11%. Eventually changed the fuel pressure regulator - improved the LTFTs but still got an intermittent hot stall.
This didn't stop until I swapped over the Idle Air Control Valve (IACV) with a spare I had. According to info on the site 24V IACVs are very robust but I've never had a hot stall since.
The cure might've been the new IACV or the fact I put a new gasket on as well. Are the vacuum lines intact?
Similarly, late model looms were meant to be more robust - but who knows!
Is the MAF OK (linear uptake of O2 when revs go up)? Is the connection between the MAF and the central (plastic) plenum chamber secure/air tight (mine's a real barlam and have to be careful whenever looking at air filter of MAF otherwise it just comes loose - even when it looks secure).
What do you mean when you say "just the usual O2 sensors it's always shown"?
My car has always run a little rich but plugs always look perfect.
Frustrating when you can't pinpoint problem but HTH.
Paul
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whentostop
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #9 on: Oct 31st, 2013, 7:36pm » |
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Thanks guys - some good ideas to work on...
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97 Black 24v Estate
97 Black 24v Saloon
94 Blue 24v Granada Estate
94 Blue 12v Granada Estate
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a900one
Full Member
A scorpio is for life not just for christmas
Posts: 980
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #10 on: Nov 1st, 2013, 9:27pm » |
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Have you changed the fuel filter.
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whentostop
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #11 on: Nov 3rd, 2013, 5:40pm » |
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on Nov 1st, 2013, 9:27pm, a900one wrote:| Have you changed the fuel filter. |
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Yep - fuel pump and fuel filter was my first thought
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97 Black 24v Estate
97 Black 24v Saloon
94 Blue 24v Granada Estate
94 Blue 12v Granada Estate
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Nunnspoet
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I love YaBB 1G - SP1!
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Re: Cutting out when warm
« Reply #12 on: Nov 7th, 2013, 12:05pm » |
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I just thought this post may help.
A shot in the dark. Talking about the dark: When it is good and dark with the engine running lift the bonnet and have a good look about for any sparking.
One of my 24 valve Scorpios died suddenly and would not start.
Cause: The engine cover had shorted out the Ignition module
Remedy: Remove the engine cover separate the individual cables on the top
of the plug and insulate; look at the underside of the engine cover and you
will see where the cables/shorting has taken place. Do not repace the
engine cover without ensuring that there is no chance of further contact
between the two. Spacers on top of the enginne cover securing studs should do
the trick.
She died suddenly on a very busy dual carriageway in Truro on Thursday.
Best regards.
Happy Scorpio Christmas
Mike
p.s. always carry a 10mm. socket, thin nosed pliers and Insulation Tape
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