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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> ENGINE OIL
        
(Message started by: johnv on Mar 5^th, 2005, 5:44pm)

Title: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 5^th, 2005, 5:44pm

I am due to have a bit of a service next week on the Cosworth.
Up to now I always used the Castrol Magnetec, (well you know what I mean) 5/30. which is semi synthetic.
Some one on this site a while ago said he likes that mobil full synthetic.
I just read up a little on that. its saying that with Fully Synthetic, you get increased performance and more miles per gallon
Do you think that is right.
I mean with the posh petrol I am getting 3 MPG on each gallon of petrol so that pays for the extra cost of the fuel.
Will it be the same on oil. Will I get still more increased MPG to take care of the increased cost of the oil.
Like Halfords have that Mobile 0w/40 at £28.79 but that's for 4lts not 5 lts.
and do castrol do a fully synthetic oil

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 5^th, 2005, 6:17pm

Hi John .. I rate Mobil 1 as probably the best oil made and cannot speak highly enough of it .. but it isn't better or worse in the Cosworth than much cheaper equivalents ..Magnatec is site recommended I believe ..and my recommendation would be Comma X-Tech 5/30 .. known incorrectly as a cheap company.. but frequently near the top in the oil charts ..it's a great oil and semi synthetic at around £20 quid ish .. 5ltrs not 4 either ... regards ....STN

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by desandlorraine on Mar 5^th, 2005, 7:11pm

hi john, dont know if they do it where you live but halfords do oil and filter change for £27 for up to 2.0 and £35 for above this is with magnatec i am in preston dont know if this applies elsewhere just a thought

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by scorpio_man on Mar 5^th, 2005, 7:34pm

hi there

i wouldn't use the halford stuff! re the oil grade sae 5w-30 is for the 16 valve engines. sae 10w-30 is for the 24 valve, as per the handbook (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/handbook144.gif)

fao 16 valve owners, national (http://www.national.co.uk/promotions/promotions.html) will do a oil+filter change from £20 (sae 5-30)

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 5^th, 2005, 7:39pm

hey; save the night.
But that Comma stuff is just cheap muck is it not.
The sort of stuff you see for sale at around £4.99 for 5 lts in back street stores and at super-markets.
I would not be happy with using that in a cosworth that had only done 60,000 miles.
I know you trying to be helpful and i note what you say about known incorrectly as a cheap company.
I wonder why people like me, think that, about these sort of un-famous names.
But I would not be happy, not when there are world famous oil companies around.
But thanks for your input, I hope I not upset you when you where so good as to use you time to do me a posting.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 5^th, 2005, 7:47pm

hi to scorpio_man;
Thanks for that.
Well I will have to take professional advise.
I would not use 10W in any car of mine. I don't want my chains rattling.
I would not use Halfords oil, their own brand, no need to when there is many branded makes around.
but you got me thinkin and until I clear of what grade oil to use in the cosworth, I won't proceed.
I will let you know what and who it is that tells me what I find out.
But thanks for getting me to re-search further.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 5^th, 2005, 7:58pm

hi to desandlorraine,
i live in Coventry. I do buy from Halfords stores. but I would not let any Halfords chaps from service bays touch my cars.
£27 is dear for a 2000cc car. they are dear on tyres sales as well.
At ATS near me they do a oil change for £23 using shell syn oil 3/30.
What I do is take my own filter and oil and if my garage is doing other service work, they don't charge for labour.
The reason why I do it that way, is that I insist upon a genium Ford filter, no other make.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Can you tell me this.
In Coventry, Halford service bays where handed over to AA. (but it turned out that they where the same Halfords staff dressed up in AA overhauls).
Then the AA gave their service outlets over to National.
I not been to look but I got a letter from the AA to say that a few weeks ago.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 5^th, 2005, 8:30pm

Hi John ..and yes Comma IS the sort of stuff you see at 5.99 as I pointed out .. but if you do your research then you'll find that giant Duckhams oil for instance is actually a mixture of all the waste oils that you can imagine < although again a great oil > .. but I never suggest things lightly as you may not know and take it from me that you and your engine will be far safer listening ..and then checking and confirming yourself .. than you will with some of your world famous companies .. check the oil charts and you will find that Comma consistently lays above virtually all the " known " big brands ..and my last thirty years of racing and preparing Cosworth and other engines with Mobil1 mainly but with Comma too ..gives me a far greater experience than yourself ..unless i am mistaken of course .. and wasn't that why you asked the question in the first place .. for professional advice ?? regards ........ STN

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Highlander on Mar 5^th, 2005, 9:26pm

Lol Touche ;D

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Badboytunes on Mar 5^th, 2005, 10:30pm

Ouch LOL :D :D :D

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Pam and John on Mar 5^th, 2005, 11:44pm

Halfords own brand synthetic is, as far as I know, re-branded Comma. Have been using it for about six years now in various cars (granada, volvo, 24V granada and v6 probe) and not had any problems. Also Halfords do 2 for 1 offers most bank holidays, so if you plan in advance, savings can be made. Comma always seems to get good reports when you do the research.

To be honest, would avoid Magnetec as have heard it has a high sulphur content and can leave nasty deposits. May or may not be true, but won't be using it.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 6:53am

yes .I think your right too Pam and John .. may are indeed Comma re-branded as are the new caterham oils .. Comma is also proven much safer for catalytic converters than many others ..I too am frightened by Halfords stuff ..but I have no idea why as I have never used it .. it's all a bit personal choice I reckon but also life and technology move on and if one is even more specific then perhaps we should all be using the new standards of ILSEC GF 4 ..starburst oils .. agreed its a new MINIMUM standard ..but a very modern standard for sure .. API < american petroleum institute > set oil standards but american oils are not always great for european engines who use ACEA or SAE ..but the new stadards are a mix of American ..Japanese and European and take into account during testing many many more criteria than previously .. for instance as you point out .. sulphur and metallic content .. cats ..emmisions ..deposits ..water retention ..weight loss due to evaporation and so on and so on .. Gawd !! i'm rambling ...... byeeeeeeeee ..... STN

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 7:04am

the worst thing to do however is for members to read posts like these and think of changing from ordinary multigrade to synthetic !! .. that's the NO NO and the worst thing to do ... just thought i would get that across ..... cheers ..... STN

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 7:44am

so magnetec is now no good because of surpher.
so what is Ford oil like. i mean their own brand. i used to used that in my transits.
This is a very hard subject to research as all firms and people all claim this and that.
So is it best to use full synthetic or semi sythetic.

Well does any one know which oil Ferrarri forula one racing cars use because they are rare to break down. where as Mercedes are always breaking down. with engine troubles.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 7:54am

Ferrari use Shell John ...but they are a bit crafty because they use a " blend " .. but that isn't what you need anyway .. remember .. ALL oils have to meet a standard .. so most are fine and meet the minimum requirement ..it simply depends what you want from it .. Ford is fine but I very much doubt that it's actually Ford !! .. tolerances are what matter and it depends on what a particular engine requires .. additives for instance can be great in a worn ford engine but the kiss of death in a Cosworth due to the tolerance of the piston ring holes and tensioner set up and hydraulic cam followers..< the reason I use 5/30 in the winter and 10/30 or 40 in the summer > .. you have no probelms at the moment so why change ? .. your own experience is that what you use now is doing fine ... cheers ....... STN

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 8:26am

Hi Silent-the night. well in the cosworth i don't know what is in the engine. I only just got the car a while ago.
But it did beyond to a director of Guest Motors, who are big Ford people around and about.
So I presume the oil is Ford, but it might not be.
So it seams that Mobile one might be a good choice from what you say and lots of others are saying about it in test reports.
--------------------------------------------------------------------See in the old days when you started to use oil, you bunged in the next higher SAE grade.
but nowadays, cars don't use oil, Well I do see a odd one belting out blue smoke but that's the way the engine as been abused.
I had a older transit van and the cam went because the oilway hole was to small and they made it bigger then it was put right under guarantee.
So I am off putting, in using 10/40 like indeed it does state in the owners handbook.
I mean should anyone take any notice of the makers Ford. I mean we all read the recent posts on the cosworths and their engine problems.
Not forgetting, the seat cover that keep coming off everytime you sit on them and the hub bearing and drive shaft bearings that fall to bits not forgetting distrorted brake discs etc.
One point is that most people are saying that full sym oils give you higher performance and more economy. over semi sym. I not to fussed about performance as I am not a boy racer. but if you get more miles per gallon. then yes i am into that, because it would offset the higher price.
So if I decide to use the comma X-tec where would you get that. Halfords might sell the cheaper Comma's but would they sell the high tec stuff.
I will have to call in Halfords to have a look.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Snoopy on Mar 6^th, 2005, 8:28am

I go along with STN on this one If what you are using now has not caused any problems... then why change it. I personally use Comma semi synthetic and we run Comma Fully synthetic in our two Metros and the Caterham 7 its used by them from new so thats good enough for us... I used to use Duckhams but changed to Comma many years ago... It has never done my engines any harm, but then again I change it every 3000 its so cheap that you can afford to.

we buy in bulk from a local factor is even cheaper that way.

I also change the filter at £3.00 a time it has to be the best policy... Like STN I use 5/30 in winter and 10.40 in summer

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 8:31am

think of changing from ordinary multigrade to synthetic .
---------------------------------------------------------------------
well everyone know that, even me!

There is a good page on the Web called The Oil Bible.

It also has a Tyre and wheel Bible for those that do not know how many times a wheel goes around. ;D

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 9:08am

hey silent the night.
so come on them tell me which make of oil you are using. I mean you should know me be now. I promise I will not laugh. ;) ;D
But why not use the 5/30 oil all year round. why the need to change to 10/40.
so its looks like mobile one or comma hi tec 5/30.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 9:18am

hi snoopy,
well i have been using castrol magetec 5/30 but people are saying it got surphur produced.
so that has got me rethinking.
i keep hearing all the time about the mobile one oil how good it is.
well people are right i reckon. because old police grandna's used to belt up and down the M6 and their engines used to go around the clock mile monitor over two times. (well you know what I mean.)
so they would not have used these moderm sym oils. so its mobile one or comma hi-tec 5/30

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Badboytunes on Mar 6^th, 2005, 10:11am

on 03/06/05 at 08:26:32, johnv wrote:

Hi Silent-the night.

John,
I think you will find that STN = Save the night.......

Cheers Nick ;)

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 2:54pm

perhaps John is trying to tell me something Nick !! oohhhh ... SILENT the night ....

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 2:55pm

yes John ..I use Comma x-tech in the Cossie but I also have loads of customers that use Magnatec too ..
I reckon it's good bet that yours has Ford oil in given the circumstances .. and thats fine ..
I use 5w/30 in the winter because the " w" bit stands for winter or colder .. thinner and slightly quicker acting when it's colder .. personal preference though .. others will say there is no difference maybe ..

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by SaveTheNight on Mar 6^th, 2005, 3:01pm

Quote:

But it did beyond to a director of Guest Motors, who are big Ford people around and about.
So I presume the oil is Ford, but it might not be.

Quote:

hi snoopy,
well i have been using castrol magetec 5/30 but people are saying it got surphur produced.
so that has got me rethinking.

?? ..........

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 4:44pm

hi sorry i got your name wrong so its save not silent. sorry.
but you will need to keep up with me as regards cars.
but i'm not blaming you for getting mixed up, because sometimes i don't remember which car i am in.
it has been know for me to park up somewhere in the maroom one and when i arrive back i'm looking for the blue one.
In three cars I have magetec 5/30 because at that time i was thinking it was a good oil. i not saying it is the very best just that it must be a good oil along with the best.
the reason why, i started this thread was that my latess car a cosworth 1998 with 60,000 and something on the clock is due for a full service this week or soon.
I was just wondering if there was anything better that magetec.
What I thinking off now is use that coma hi -tec oil and then I can change it once per year on the day of the MOT. Does that make sence.
Or use the mobile one and change it every two years again at MOT time.
So which of these would you do.
Of course what I decide I will do it in time in all cars, not just the cosworth.
at the end of the day, the way I drive any old sym oil would do. but I believe in always striving for the very best.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 6^th, 2005, 4:55pm

but why don't you keep the 5/30 in all year round. why change to 10/30
i got it in my head that the more thiner the oil the more it will get around the engine.
i mean i understood that modern sym oils don't thin down when they get hot like the olden day mineral oils.
I would not be happy in using 10/30 even in the summer.
That's why I was looking at Mobile 0ne because its 0/30. god that must get around the engine all right.
So you would not need to change that oil in the summer would you
So are you going to tell your customers that the magetec oils will dirty their engines with surhrur now.
I was quite happy up to now with that until I was told that.
But thanks for all the advice you given me, I got a good idea now where as before I did not.
If you don't ask you will never know.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by martin_rowe on Mar 7^th, 2005, 9:01am

Sulphur is just one of the additives in oil, its a lubricant you know, thats why more diesel injection pumps ar packing up now, people are useing low sulphur diesel, it dosent lubricate the pumps enough.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 7^th, 2005, 12:27pm

golly, so sulpur is good for your engine. because its a lubricate.
I was thinking that Castrol Magetec can't be that bad as its Liquied Engineering. says so on the container.
It very hard to research this item as I can't see any test reports by independant people, only themselves.
Since no hurry.
Still might go down the mobile one route or perhps stay with Magetec. 5/30.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by shaunskiman on Mar 7^th, 2005, 1:31pm

I don't know about anybody else reading this topic, but I was thinking about changing the oil in my cossy I don't know whats in it at the moment and now after reading this topic I am very confused ??? ??? ???
STN Mentioned engine additives and the killing of the Cosworth engine do,s this mean DO NOT use winns ETC ETC ETC ???
A Very confused Shaun................ :o

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Snoopy on Mar 7^th, 2005, 5:40pm

Read the page about OIL ADDITIVES Modern Oils have enough in them to suit most engines and its all a money makinf#g execrcise. Oil companies spend £millions on R&D.

Can cause MORE problems IMHO...

have read of this it might help http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/snakeoil.htm

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 7^th, 2005, 7:50pm

Calling the Oily expert.
One last question please.
I always understood that the lower the vis number like 10W or 5W the more easy the oil to get around your oilways.
Well I thinking of just on the Cosworth and that car only going for the mobile one. i mean thats 0/30 that would get round the engine for sure.
See cars nowaday don't burn or consume oil like old cars do.
But as it states in the handbook and as one person pointed out it says 10/40 for cosworth.
This I not understanding. like I said the more thinner the oil the more it will shoot around the engine so a low vis oil like 5 or 0 would in fact be better than 10.
Unless its something to do with the oil pump, like if there is a little wear in it, then it would not catch the 0 or 5 oil so well as the 10.

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by johnv on Mar 7^th, 2005, 7:59pm

additives.
In the old days with mineral oils there was lots of muck on the market for putting in your engine, gearbox, rear axle. etc.
Even then there was lots of talk about them not being needed as oils could not be inproved upon.
But nowadays, with modern synthetic oils that is even more so.
I would not consider wasting money on these. they might even do harm.
I sure I read in the past that they can do away with the manufactors guarantee. by using them.
I would rather use that money you would have spent on additives to buy the very best oil money can buy

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Geoff_W on Mar 8^th, 2005, 12:51am

John

The very best oil that money can buy is already a blend of additives.

Now heres a thought what happens if somebody then comes up with an additional and proprietery additive that say improves the very best.

Say it improves encapsulation of dirt or the molecules carry greater weight, or coat the bearing surfaces at start up even better, or it dissipates heat better. Or maybe it copes with a 20,000 mile cycle better.

Then the very best oil in the world would move into second place and there would be a new champion possibly from the same company. (While we are talking all the oil companies are looking for an edge)

The additive market has been with us for a long time, wether it is in the lubricant or the fuel. That Cata stuff that you put in is an additive and Optimax contains additional elements which are additives.

One thing for sure the latest oils were developed after our engines were designed and we need to keep track of developments to see if anything will extend the reliable/useful life of the 24v,16v,12v or 8v.

Regular oil and filter changes with good quality oil GTX in those days kept my mk3 Granada running to 340k plus without any engine work needed. But I also added Slik 50 every 50,000 miles.

Just coming up to 192k in my Scorp. I know that the site view is that existing oils should be enough but I will keep my eye open just in case someone comes up with a silver bullet. (I have been using a specific additive since 50k with this one and will let you folks know which one when and if it gets to 200k)

You started a good thread with this one it could run and run. ;)

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Geoff_W on Mar 9^th, 2005, 9:44am

Or maybe not

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Badboytunes on Mar 9^th, 2005, 10:31am

on 03/09/05 at 09:44:07, Geoff_W wrote:

Or maybe not

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Eddie on Mar 10^th, 2005, 10:52pm

Vauxhall 5w30 synthetic=£36.60 for 4X5ltrs

.. 10w40 semi =£18.00 for 4X5ltrs.

eddie

Title: Re: ENGINE OIL
Post by Geoff_W on Mar 11^th, 2005, 2:13pm

Eddie,

Those are pretty keen case quantity prices.

I know this is going to sound stupid but who makes the oil for Vauxhall?

It ought to be premium stuff