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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Sounds painfull
        
(Message started by: cossieguy on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:34pm)

Title: Sounds painfull
Post by cossieguy on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:34pm

Went to start car this morning and the noise coming from engine sounded awful. It had been getting loud lately due to cold and sounded like a diesel however this morning was especially cold -3c. There was a very loud knocking sound coming from engine(At a frequency relative to tick over) like someone banging a hammer against metal and you could feel it through engine. It went away after about 2 mins, I assume as oil got a little warmer/around engine. The car drives fine and starts first time. Is it worth changing the oil and if so to what(Brand/type)? If it's not oil related any ideas?
Guy.

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by taliban on Dec 18^th, 2006, 8:40pm

changing the oil has never done any harm, it might not be needed, but will only do good.
being a cossie i would suggest the best oil you can afford, i.e. fully synthetic 0w 40 or 5w 40, being a lower viscosity, fully synthetic will also circulate and lubricate quicker....

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by monghad on Dec 18^th, 2006, 10:41pm

I have noticed that my engine's a bit 'tappity' on start up but quietens after a wee while, I am putting it down to the oil not getting into the hydraulic tappits(2.0 16v) quick enough because of the cold...at least that is my uneducated diagnosis. :-[ :), (maybe I'll try an oil change as taliban suggested, semi-synthetic seems to be the oil of choice for this engine.)

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by jonnycab on Dec 19^th, 2006, 10:09am

I may be wrong, but don't the timing chain tensioners tend to rattle a bit when very cold, & then quieten down after a minute or so. :-/

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by cossieguy on Dec 19^th, 2006, 10:24am

on 12/19/06 at 10:09:30, jonnycab wrote:

I may be wrong, but don't the timing chain tensioners tend to rattle a bit when very cold, & then quieten down after a minute or so. :-/

Be nice if that's all it is ;) It does get less frequent then dissappear after 1min or so(This morning). According to the car and my hands it was -5c this morning when i started her.
Guy.

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by mr._floppy on Dec 19^th, 2006, 7:44pm

A few posters have disabled the ignition system so it doesn't fire up, cranked the engine a few times to pressurise the lube system, then started as normal thus lessening the dreaded winter rattly chain/tappet syndrome.

Or have I got it wrong >:(

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Highlander on Dec 19^th, 2006, 8:31pm

Nearly :)

If you put your foot to the floor so that Wide Open Throttle (WOT) is detected then the engine SHOULD not fire but still turn over therefore oil the bits..

be aware though that some people have reported the engine firing when doing this which is a bit exciting :)

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by cossieguy on Dec 19^th, 2006, 9:56pm

on 12/19/06 at 20:31:24, Highlander wrote:

be aware though that some people have reported the engine firing when doing this which is a bit exciting :)

Typical >:( If you remember Stuart i'm one of the people who's cars will start in WOT so can't use that to prelube the system :(
Guy.

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by scorpio_man on Dec 19^th, 2006, 10:01pm

hi there

get a scan of the tps to check it's going from about 16% to about 93%. if that checks out, then replace the WOT relay.

hth

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Octavian_P on Dec 22^nd, 2006, 5:40pm

My cossie has a real bad rattle....i think sometimes it gets to 10 seconds.....(and also rattles a bit eaven when warm), i hope in the summer i'll be "prepared" to fix it. Until then i'm using one of these http://www.autoenginelube.com/howitworks.html
It really reduces the rattle. Some times it won't rattle at all. And when it's cold outside it starts verry easy.

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Geoff_W on Dec 22^nd, 2006, 9:52pm

Didnt Vlad Soare have something similar fitted to his Cossie?

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Octavian_P on Dec 26^th, 2006, 10:33am

Weeelll from Vlad I bought the car.... ;)

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Geoff_W on Dec 26^th, 2006, 1:38pm

Well if the autolube device is doing the trick I would keep using it. Vlad seemed quite impressed with it when he installed it in about 2002/3ish?

Nice to see that you are keeping a Cossie that we already know about on the road!

What did Vlad get, do you know?

Seasons greets

Geoff

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by Octavian_P on Dec 27^th, 2006, 8:15am

Yes, the prelube-kit does the trick, but the rattle is getting worse now, when it's cold outside (engine oils also needs to be changed), regardless the lube, it rattles for 10-15 seconds.(temperature dropped to -6 C) and on the following minutes if I rev it slow it starts to rattle aging (but just a little,it’s more like ticking noise, maybe tappets). When it's warm outside it is like magic, no rattle at all, so I’m putting a lot of problems on the oil...which of course I will change soon ;) …..only did around 300 mile with it from when I bought it (and I’m a bit short on cash now). Anyway the prelube beside curing the rattle it also makes the engine start very easy, oil pressure it’s already built up, it’s nice it protects the engine at cold starts, taking oil where it isn’t

Vlad bought a small 4x4, he has a new passion mud, rock, stiff, mountain off-roading ....couldn't take the Scorpio there :) and we both wanted a good future for it, so now I have two of them ;D

LATER EDIT:

Vlad also worked on an electric pre-luber, that one could cure the rattle no mater how worse is (or how cold) because you could prelube as long as you want. The kit that is installed on the cossie I think it holds about 1-1.5 liters of oil at best....and the pressure it’s at best the maximum pressure of the oil pump that has been achieved before "dumping the oil". The only thing we need now its a powerful but small enough electric 12 volt motor that could power a secondary oil pump (from another car), or a small electric oil pump, which I couldn't find at a "normal" price....

Cheers

Title: Re: Sounds painfull
Post by sector-9 on Jan 6^th, 2007, 4:50pm

I used to have a (Granada) Scorpio years back when I was younger - that's what got me into the the big Fords; it was one of the nicest cars I've owned and good on fuel too for a 2.8i.

Anyways, the reason I got rid of it was because it would sometimes make a loud metallic knocking/scraping noise in time with the engine revs. This kept getting worse and louder until one day going around a bend I lost all drive through the auto box. I turned off the engine and then tried restarting but the starter just whirred without turning the engine.

If I'd bothered to remove the auto box then it's quite likely I'd have seen the problem - the drive plate from the crankshaft to the torque converter had sheared off so the starter wouldn't turn the engine and the engine wouldn't turn the gearbox! The noise was from the fractured driveplate rubbing against the engine block until it finally broke altogether.

Wish I'd seen it myself - I'd certainly have fixed it and kept it (especially as it had five new tyres about a month earlier!)

Darren