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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Red Key
        
(Message started by: Waglet on Jan 31^st, 2009, 5:31pm)

Title: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Jan 31^st, 2009, 5:31pm

Had a non-starting incident. I think it was immobiliser related. I don't have a Red Key for the vehicle can I get one?

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Snoopy on Feb 1^st, 2009, 8:00am

Yes if you need one .. A
Many of the auto locksmiths carry the equipment to programme a new RED Key they can be located from HERE (http://www.autolocksmith.co.uk/)

From the past posts on here they charge between £50/70 still cheaper than a FMD as far as I know.
A red key only allows you to programme new keys why do you think its imobiliser related.
Does the LED on the top of the dash flash a code??? . Check out THIS PAGE (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/pats.htm) which might give some help.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 1^st, 2009, 10:49pm

Thanks Snoop. The reason I think its key/mobiliser is that after half a day and a bit desperate I tried the spare key that I was given with the car and it started! This key has a red insert. I retried the other key (this one has the light module and a red insert that has gone a bit brown in colour) and that made the car start as well. Its been OK since.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 2^nd, 2009, 7:22pm

Car has failed to start again. Had to leave it at work. Doh. It turns over but fails to start, PATS light seems 'normal'. Had it serviced last week, all was well for 4 days then this. Any clues?

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Snoopy on Feb 2^nd, 2009, 7:29pm

Try checking the relays. I am sure someone will advise which one to look at first.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Simmo on Feb 2^nd, 2009, 8:15pm

Before you go too far try getting a jump start. IF the battery has been run down it may have enough power to TURN the engine but not sufficient to START the car. :)

Title: Re: Red Key:- Now non starter :(
Post by Waglet on Feb 4^th, 2009, 8:31am

Tried a 'jump', no good. Weird that it failed Friday then started and was fine for 2 days now non starting again. A previous link I've read suggests a crank sensor. I guess I'll call out the breakdown peeps and get it towed to my local chap who serviced and MOT'd it last week. What aggro.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by ivan on Feb 4^th, 2009, 9:45am

Something like that happend to my car but mine didn`t start at all the first time it happend(turns but wont start)...water liking thru dashboard all the way in to ECU...drainholes clogged...result --- ECU corroded and defected...been to few mechanics and they didn`t know whats wrong...they check fuses,wires,fuel pump,sparks, everything but they havent got a clue whats wrong.

Maybe in your case very small amount of water is gettin thru the ECU...so when ECU is dry it works...so you can check ECU also.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Jonnycab on Feb 4^th, 2009, 11:09am

If it were a PATS problem then the engine wouldn't turn over, so it looks as though it could be something else :)

Ivan has a point about the ECU. Have you checked the back of it for wetness caused by water leaking in under the battery tray ?

Have you checked the fuel pump relay ?, they can sometimes be a bit temperamental.....& the crankshaft sensor could also be a culprit. Also, check that the small black wire on the battery negative is on nice & tight ;)

Good luck :)

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 4^th, 2009, 11:50am

Thanks everyone....loads of info for the "fixers" to work on.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by ivan on Feb 4^th, 2009, 12:39pm

Yea I know :o 8)

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 4^th, 2009, 1:47pm

Call out man suspects fuel pump. Is this likely? Any one know which relay is the "fuel pump" one?

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Jonnycab on Feb 4^th, 2009, 3:09pm

Fuel pump relay is 'R17' in the battery side fusebox. It's the big green one with half purple top :)

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 4^th, 2009, 7:48pm

Top Man JC. Ordered one this afternoon. Garage man said it smelt a bit burnt! Also fuse box is wet. Doh. The annoying thing is as soon as they took the car off the tow truck it started up OK. Doh again!! They think its not the fuel pump so that'll save a few quid!

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Simmo on Feb 4^th, 2009, 10:22pm

If the fusebox is wet you need to resolve it PDQ. Have you got a battery cover fitted and are the 'drain holes' in the bulkhead clear?. Read THIS (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/battery.htm) as it will give you a clear idea of what you can do to ensure all is well in terms of drainage. Is there any sign of water in the passenger footwell or glovebox?.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 4^th, 2009, 11:54pm

Yep battery cover in place, I did WD4 the area around the battery as soon as I bought the car last summer. No wet in passenger side etc. I'll get the garage to dry out the area and hope for the best. Just hope it becomes reliable again. You don't realise how much you take the car for granted until you have to use public transport. :'( Its ironic that only last week I was signing the Scorps praises and thinking how good I felt driving it.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Simmo on Feb 5^th, 2009, 7:49am

Waglet. If it is the drivers side fusebox that is wet you need to make sure that the small drain holes/slots in the bulkhead are also clear. A hair dryer sometimes is enough to remove moisture but ideally keep 'em dry in the first place. :)

Title: Re: Red Key:- Back from menders.
Post by Waglet on Feb 10^th, 2009, 10:26am

Got car back yesterday. Right when tested. Doh. So I'm just waiting for it to fail again :( They did change the fuel pump relay (green and purple one). On inspection this relay did smell a bit burnt (just like my Scalextrix cars did when they were about to give up the ghost) So fingers crossed........... :-/

Title: Re: Red Key.....Failed again
Post by Waglet on Feb 12^th, 2009, 9:30am

Back to drawing board.....failed to start again! Any one want a 24v Purple one?

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 17^th, 2009, 8:06pm

Gonna call the breakdown dudes again tomorrow and get the Scorp towed back to the menders as it will not start. Not sure how much of this aggro I can take. I really like Scorpios but I must have reliability.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Tons_of_fun on Feb 21^st, 2009, 5:04pm

Just out of curiosity have you checked the wiring to the fuel cut off switch ? I had a mystery starting fault on my old 95 12v estate which turned out to be this. HTH

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 21^st, 2009, 5:42pm

I'm open to any idea/solution. Thanks, I'll give it a look :D

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Snoopy on Feb 22^nd, 2009, 8:07am

I still suspect that it will be the fuel cut off loom ar associated with it.
Other will tell you the location of it .....!

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by scorpio_man on Feb 22^nd, 2009, 1:45pm

hi there

have you checked ALL the wiring. the part that runs across the x beam under the radiator, the 'junction boxes' (2 x 10mm nuts on top, o/s inner wing) and the wiring to the EDIS unit. i think it's next to the coil pack on the 24v, but i'm not sure.

check all that out first. if that doesn't work, i have a way of temporally removing the security system from the car, but i'm VERY unwilling to share this info unless ALL OTHER CHECKS HAVE BEEN CARRIED OUT FIRST.

hth

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 22^nd, 2009, 6:05pm

Thanks for all the tips. Mr Scorpio Man Sir....
I am going to check all wiring and will be seeking your
temporary measure as a last resort. The car is only
ever parked at my house on the drive behind my
'large hedge' or at my place of work in a seure
car park so security is not really an issue.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 23^rd, 2009, 7:05pm

Failed to start again. Scorpio man I've sent you an instant message and an email.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Feb 24^th, 2009, 11:03pm

Ford Main Dealer then? Looks like I scared off the Independent Ford Specialist as he never returned the message I left him. All I've got to do is get it started and get it there. hee hee. I presume they will diagnose the fault and fix it without ripping me off? My alternative is to buy the Saab I've been loaned.....its a superb drive but not quite a Scorpio.

Title: Re: Red Key
Post by Waglet on Apr 3^rd, 2009, 9:39pm

Got the car back today. 1 day too late! Bit the bullet and bought the Saab, which incidentally is a glorified Vectra or similar as its GM! After all the mucking about the very 1st diagnosis was the correct one: - sender unit in fuel pump burnt out! Might have to sell the Scorpio :-/ :'(