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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> 4x4 diff ratios
        
(Message started by: Highlander on Jun 27th, 2009, 11:26pm)
Title: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jun 27th, 2009, 11:26pm
Any of you old dudes know what the Sierra/Granada 4x4 diff ratios were? ;)
Were there different ones?
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jun 28th, 2009, 12:39am
front  3.62:1
rear   3.62:1 this is on the 2.8 / 2.9


The cosworth 4x4 was different I have it some where will post it A.S.A.P

quick search found this . . . .

LOL some people take the p**s when it says COSWORTH / MINKER

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Sierra-3-14-diff-V8-kit-car-MNIKER-7-3-14-1-LSD_W0QQitemZ220439387182QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item3353361c2e&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65:12
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by gozz on Jun 28th, 2009, 4:00pm
Good job they are both the same  ;) imagine the tyre wear !
                                           GOZZ
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jun 28th, 2009, 5:43pm

on 06/27/09 at 23:26:40, Highlander wrote:
Any of you old dudes know what the Sierra/Granada 4x4 diff ratios were? ;)
Were there different ones?


Do I smell a 4x4 Scorpio conversion going on here  ???

As GOZZ says, pretty important to have matching front and rear diff ratios.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jun 29th, 2009, 12:43pm
Maybe ;)

I'm nearly ready to get into a manual conversion job so just thinking out loud
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jun 29th, 2009, 1:03pm
Nice one  ;D

Got a bit of 4WD project on myself at the moment only not with a Scorpio, something else with a blue oval badge on though  ;)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jun 29th, 2009, 4:14pm
So are the front and rear crown wheels interchangeable or is it a completely different animal?

The car I'm doing it on currently has a 4.27 diff, I'd rather keep it like that if possible but I dont know if a rear 4.27 set up would fit in the front?

If not then I can just go with the standard diff set up.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jun 29th, 2009, 5:18pm

on 06/29/09 at 16:14:50, Highlander wrote:
So are the front and rear crown wheels interchangeable or is it a completely different animal?

The car I'm doing it on currently has a 4.27 diff, I'd rather keep it like that if possible but I dont know if a rear 4.27 set up would fit in the front?

If not then I can just go with the standard diff set up.


No, front & rear crownwheels are totally different.

Front diff bolts to the offside of the sump on the 4x4 and is about 1/2 the size of the rear diff. Drive to the nearside wheel is via a shaft which goes through the sump.

Get hold of a V6 Sierra Haynes manual ( couple of £'s on fleabay ) and all will be revealed. The Mk3 Granada Haynes manual I have does not cover the 4x4 models - although the setup is basically the same as on the Sierra.  

There were also 4-cyl Sierra's with 4WD - not sure but think the sump from one of these would fit a Scorpio DOHC block if you don't want to go down the V6 route.

You would need to sort something out for the speedo drive - early 4x4 models are driven off the nearside front output to the driveshaft, don't know about later models though.  
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jun 29th, 2009, 10:30pm
OH ah can of worms opened here  }{

Haveing owned a xr4x4 2.8 for over 17yrs untill my accident and now got an AUTO ultima. .
I can say that I was well into the 4x4 scene and that I can deffo tell you the 4x4 2ltr was way down on power and fuel wise . .
Now the 2,8 is a lot better but the 66/34 split drive rear to front is awesome as most people seem to think that its engaged 4x4 all the time ( yes in theory ) but as the front wheel spins  then the viscous coulping jumps in and puts power to the rear LSD and vice versa
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by pinto on Jun 29th, 2009, 10:46pm
3.62 Diff ratio for the 6 pots, 3.92 ratio for the 2.0 XR4x4s  - remember that sierras ALL had 7" rear diffs, so not interchangable with the scorp or granny :)

3.14 Ratio was a rare option, only found in the 2300 N/A Diesel sierras or some scandinavian xr4x4s - Turbo technics also used them along with a custom made crownwheel for the Minker's front diff :)

Scorps share a 7.5" Crownwheel with the granada or 2WD cosworth sierra - these are available in other ratios (i beleive 3.34 being the lowest and 4.27 the highest)

Gazza - believe me when i say that WILL sell at that price ;) - the diff being sold is my friend Marty, who built me one to go on a sapphire 24v conversion that didnt happen; i sold my diff to a gent with a v8 kit car for exactly what he's charging....
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jun 29th, 2009, 10:53pm

on 06/29/09 at 22:46:09, pinto wrote:
Gazza - believe me when i say that WILL sell ...


Never said it wont  8)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by martin_rowe on Jun 30th, 2009, 8:34am
3.34 would then be the highest, and 4.27 the lowest.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 17th, 2009, 8:01pm
Well thanks to Gazza's guidance I've just picked myself up a nice 1988 2.9 4x4 for £200  ;D

Only thing is, the more I look at it the more I think it deserves to be back on the road, its had a lot of work done to it and really just needs some tidying up and finishing off..

Had a shot in it tonite, very fast and holds the road great.

will have a good look at it tomorrow and decide!

The joys of motoring!  ;D
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 17th, 2009, 8:13pm
http://i28.tinypic.com/zv7yox.jpg
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by lesterlad on Jul 17th, 2009, 9:25pm
That manual will come in handy then Stuart.
Have you collected it yet ?
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 17th, 2009, 9:31pm
Yep, picked it up tonite Rod, cheers for that :)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Geoff_W on Jul 18th, 2009, 11:12am
Stuart,

That really looks to good to break, but the thought of a 4x4 Ultima really appeals. Bit of a dilemma there then.  ???
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Geoff_W on Jul 18th, 2009, 11:35am
Spotted another possible donor. IM'd you.  ;)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jul 18th, 2009, 11:28pm
:o :o No Stuart dont drive it to much you will be sorry . . . .

But if you do . . . .
when you come to an island like you gonna go straight on
( like on a clock face from 6 to 12 o'clock ) . . .
when you are a quarter way round ( that would be 9 o'clock ) hit the power
( make sure road is empty if its your first time and dry )
also was gonna say stay in 2nd gear but its an mt75 box ::)

And hold on tight  }{ }{

Edit  Current Scorpio Fleet = 13 + 1 XR4x4
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by pinto on Jul 18th, 2009, 11:43pm
If i'd know it was just the 4x4 gear you wanted stu, I have front and rear diff's off the car ( 3.62 AND 3.92 ratios ).....

Given the scorp suspension is Mondeo based, does it all check out with hubs / shock tube diameters ?
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 20th, 2009, 11:43am
Not checked yet :)

I'm going on the urban legend that the Granada 4x4 front subframe will fit on the Scorpio therefore allowing the front driveshafts to fit (as our Scorpio wishbones are in the way just now)

5stud is digging me out a 4x4 Granada from his barn ;)

I'm sure there will be some way of connecting it all together and it has been done before I believe ;)

What other parts have you got?? i'm interested in the 3.92 diffs, is it a pair of each you have?

P.s. Gazza I know what you mean about the cornering  }{

Takes a bit of getting used to when you expect it to slide away and it doesnt lol
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jul 20th, 2009, 12:59pm
;D yea you goy it Stuart

JUST remember which car your in  :o
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 20th, 2009, 1:10pm
lol yes.

I would imagine if you really lose a 4x4 you're in real bother though!  ;D
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Gazza_UK on Jul 20th, 2009, 3:11pm
}{ Yea just a bit but you must be going some to do that . . .  }{
But I must admit them BMW Z3 things lost two of them on an Island and a couple of big Merc's
Ahh the good ole days  :(
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Jul 20th, 2009, 9:58pm
Well had an MOT inspector pal have a look over it and it looks like its a breaker  :-/ (Sorry to all you Sierra fans out there)

Nothing major wrong but lots of little jobs needing done, looks like its back to plan A...

Scorpio 24v Ultima 4x4  ;D
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by lesterlad on Jul 20th, 2009, 11:08pm

on 07/20/09 at 21:58:14, Highlander wrote:
looks like its back to plan A...

Scorpio 24v Ultima 4x4  ;D

Just a small thing, (or maybe a big thing) you need to be aware of Stuart.
On the Granada 4x4 the chassis rails (only way i can describe them) there is a cut out on both sides to allow the front drive shafts to pass under, all non 4x4 Granadas don't have this and I doubt the Scorpio would as well,
Get your self under 5studs 4x4 and take a peek, and you'll see what I mean.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jul 21st, 2009, 10:04am
Have a read of this - http://poweredbyford.co.uk/index.php?topic=88.0 - you need to register to access the article. This is the inspiration for my own current project  ;D
There is a contact number at the bottom of the page, worth giving him a call for advice.
Regarding the chassis rail cut-outs - from what I've read on other forums, they are not needed ( on the Sierra ) unless you do some serious lowering.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Sep 4th, 2009, 10:17pm

on 07/20/09 at 23:08:10, lesterlad wrote:
Just a small thing, (or maybe a big thing) you need to be aware of Stuart.
On the Granada 4x4 the chassis rails (only way i can describe them) there is a cut out on both sides to allow the front drive shafts to pass under, all non 4x4 Granadas don't have this and I doubt the Scorpio would as well,
Get your self under 5studs 4x4 and take a peek, and you'll see what I mean.



Sierra 4x4 front subframe is a straight swap for the Scorpio subframe  ;D

Got it into position tonite, Plenty clearance for the driveshafts , will post a pic tomorrow

Still got the front driveshaft/hub thing to look at and sort out but i'm sure theres a way ;)

Looking good so far....
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Scorpio_Mike on Sep 4th, 2009, 10:26pm
Are you going to be using 4-stud or 5-stud front hubs ?

I would be interested in the 5-stud 4x4 hubs if you won't be using them.
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by pinto on Sep 4th, 2009, 10:35pm
Stick with 4 stud hubs from an XR4x4 Sierra - means you can keep the scorp wheels :)

I'll have a look in my spares pile and see what diffs n stuff i have stu :)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Sep 5th, 2009, 10:42am
I dont have 5 stud hubs, the Sierra had 4 stud but they are a lot smaller than the 24v ones.

Ideally i'd like to keep the Scorpio front hubs and find a way to adapt them for 4x4, going to have a proper look today but I'm thinking about trying :

Sierra front hubs in Scorpio carriers

Scorpio rear wheel hubs in the front carriers

Mondeo 4x4 front hubs

there will be a way i'm sure... ;)

Also found out the Scorpio has the fittings on the chassis for the Sierra/Granada front antiroll bar

And that the 4x4 sump DOES fit perfectly on the 24v block  ;D

It's looking too easy....  }{

Pinto, i have the 3.6 diffs from the 2.9 Sierra 4x4 but I'd prefer the 3.9 ones from the 2 litre version if you have anything like that, got the chance of a whole 2.0 car but i'm only after the two diffs :)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by adam on Sep 5th, 2009, 2:55pm
Stu,   [] love this idea. It has me thinking  ::)  :P

Found these on Ebay if they are of any use to you.

3.92 Diff (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/COSWORTH-4X4-ESCORT-SIERRA-SAPPHIRE-3-92-FRONT-DIFF_W0QQitemZ390085301658QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item5ad2e5559a&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14)
Also for a complete 2.0 4x4 (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=150370397577&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT)
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Sep 5th, 2009, 3:18pm
Yep thats the front one i'm after but Hell will freeze over before I pay £100 for one  }{

I only paid £200 for this Sierra 4x4 complete :)

The whole car option looks to be the best bet, then i can get the whole setup and make some money back on the Sierra parts

If it works and its looking pretty good so far i'm already planning the next one, a 24v 4x4 estate  again with the 3.9 diffs that I'll use for towing
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Sep 8th, 2009, 10:16pm
Ok, first real problem :)

the 24v cats sit where the anti roll bar should be..

probably this is the reason the Scorpio subframe came into existence in the first place..

thinking cap on again...  ;D
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Dave2302 on Sep 17th, 2009, 1:14pm
Stewart,

When I did my 4x4 24v Sapphire a few years back I used the XR4x4 downpipes (very slight tweak at manifold joint on offside) with BOA ex manifolds.  You can weld in lambda bosses (and cats if you bother) where you like then.

You'll have to pop up country and see me, roof going on workshop now lol, then the 24v 4x4 RS Focus project will begin  ;D !!

PS Might be getting rid of my 24 v Estate, complete running car at the mo, just want engine, loom and wheels off it if you interested.  Loadsa new bits but needs welding on rear chassis and rear bumper.  Metallic Black, tidy in and out.

Regards Dave
Title: Re: 4x4 diff ratios
Post by Highlander on Sep 17th, 2009, 2:43pm
I'll take it :)

If you just need a donor 24v i may can do you a swap ;)


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