Ford Scorpio Forum - Print Page


    
      
        Ford Scorpio Forum
        (https://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl)
      

        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Heater Matrix
        
(Message started by: tonyboy on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 5:08pm)

Title: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 5:08pm

Hello, Got in my car today and noticed the passenger side foot well was soaking wet, my first thought was the heater matrix, so on the way home from work i checked the heating, still blowing hot, checked the header tank, still full. Call me thick but, Not knowing anything about the heating system, where does the matrix get it's water from, if it was leaking would the water in the header tank go down, and would there be hot air blowing out. Or have i got a hole under the passenger side floor. Cheers Tony

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Tompion on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 5:22pm

Yes the water in the header tank will go down, but a little water goes a long way so not necessarily instantly noticeable & yes the heater is still likely to work.
Some people have had holes rust through in the area of the battery shelf.
I believe water can get in if the drainage holes aren’t clear in the area of the auxiliary fuse box.
You need to sort it out as depending on where it's coming in it can get on the ECU and cause problems.

Dave

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 6:43pm

Thanks Dave, I think i'll check the battery compartment first, Just looked at the matrix removal, and it seems a hell of a job, they might just as well put the matrix on the moon, i'm all for trying anything but that seems well out of my ability, it seems that you have to take half the car apart to get to such a little box. do you really have to take all the facia panels off. I'm feeling a bit desponant now after looking at the removal precedure.............. :'(

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by gozz on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 8:26pm

tonyboy.
Did you taste the water to see if it is coolant,if its not sweet it may be aircon condensate leaking in owing to blocked exit clack valves.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 9:13pm

The first thing to check is Tompions idea about the Auxillary fusebox. The wires run through the bulkhead via a large grommet. If that is not seated correctly OR if the drainage holes in the battery bulkhead are not cleared water will build up and enter the car. Open the glovebox reach up to the back and open the flap which reveals the ECU. If water is present at that level then the answer is the bulkhead grommet. Have you got a battery cover fitted?.
Read This page (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/battery.htm) and check out the drainage holes etc. ;)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 9:31pm

Thanks for the advice chaps, I do have a battery cover, i'll check the battery area and the glove box, i think i'll leave the tasting bit till last. ( or i could get my lad to do that bit ) ..... :)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Tompion on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 9:54pm

The valves gozz referred to are here:
http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/acdrain.htm

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 22^nd, 2010, 10:16pm

Thanks for that i was wondering what a clack valve was. Now seeing that page my windscreen does mist up on the passenger side more. Hope it is that and not the matrix. Cheers again

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Feb 23^rd, 2010, 8:16am

If that is the case another thing to check is the pollen filter. Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cabinfilters.htm). If it gets clogged or wet it will cause misting. Is the lid correctly fitted?. :)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Jonnycab on Feb 23^rd, 2010, 9:31am

About the matrix removal...yes, the whole dash has to be removed, or at least pulled out enough so you can manoeuvre the heater box about to give enough room to pull out the matrix. I replaced mine 4 years ago & it is a real pig of a job.

If it is the matrix leaking, it usually runs down from the vent area & it's usually accompanied by a kind of curry smell. But considering all the rain we've had in the last couple of days, then I'd be inclined to think it has come in from under the battery. If this is the case then the flap of carpet that that shields the ECU etc will probably be wet & possibly the ECU will be wet as well.

As mentioned before, if it is antifreeze then it will taste/smell sweet & feel a bit sticky/greasy. If you don't fancy the taste test, then get the local cat to taste it, as cats love the sweet smell & taste of antifreeze......then, if the cat is carted off to the vets a few hours later, then you'll know you have a leaky matrix ;)..... ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Nunnspoet on Feb 23^rd, 2010, 5:21pm

:) ::) :). I Love this site Jonnycab. Great ::)

Mike ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Jonnycab on Feb 24^th, 2010, 3:08am

......here kitty-kitty ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 24^th, 2010, 6:22pm

Thanks for that JC, All i got to do now is find a cat. That one that keeps digging up our front garden and leaving us a pressie seems to be a likley candidate......... ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 25^th, 2010, 5:25pm

Hello. I checked my clack valves today, took them both out, and the passenger side was a bit grubby. Gave them both a wash and scrub, and put them back on, i think that one of them was in the wrong way the orange disc was pointing into the tube. Easy to do just took 10 minutes, it's well worth checking them, rather than run the risk of a soggy floor, should be in the yearly maintenance schedule. Will check the battery compartment at the weekend, The battery drain holes. are they the holes about half inch diameter pointing towards the engine. Thanks all for the advice.
P.S are they realy called Clack valves or is that Gozz's slang term for them........... :)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Highlander on Feb 25^th, 2010, 5:42pm

yep clack valves..

also add to the yearly schedule cleaning of

doofla sprocket
Muffler bearings
flux capacitor
blinker fluid
Alternator charger
air bag retractor

;)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 25^th, 2010, 6:04pm

What about filling up that compartment with blinks for the indicators............ :)

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by gozz on Feb 25^th, 2010, 11:26pm

A clack valve is a flap valve as found in the heart of a Sassenach,or a water pump as manufactured in Scotland,or a simple device to allow exit of fluids from an evaporator housing without entry of noxious fumes 8)
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 26^th, 2010, 8:06pm

is the sassenach in the engine............ or a marangue ...... again...... ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Feb 28^th, 2010, 4:24pm

Hello. I've cleaned out my clack valves, taken my battery out and checked for water there, a bit damp but the drain holes seem unblocked. I took the carpet up in the passengers side.and the water is dripping down underneath the rubber matting that goes up the footwell towards the back of the glove box. The water level in the header tank has gone down a bit. Is there anything else i can do to make sure if it is, or isn't the heater matrix....... Cheers

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Mar 4^th, 2010, 6:28pm

Hello. Would a MK3 granada matrix fit the scorpio.......

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Snoopy on Mar 4^th, 2010, 7:40pm

Yes by pass the heater matrix by using a short rubber hose between the feeds where they go through the bulkhead. You will have no heat but it will eliminate the leak hopefully..... If it still looses water then look elsewhere and connect the matrix back up.
I don' t think the Ganny matrix will do the job but others that have done the job will know more.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by scorpio_man on Mar 4^th, 2010, 10:33pm

hi there

afaik, the granada one will fit, but it's not the correct size (a good bit smaller,iirc).

you could always taste a little of the water. you'll soon know if you taste antifreeze! ;) :o

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Mar 4^th, 2010, 11:24pm

Thanks Snoopy for that suggestion, I think i'll have a go at tasting the water as gozz, JC, and scorpio man suggests, ( if i can't find a cat ). :). Not sure what to expect, Then i'll try the bypass at the weekend see if i still lose any coolant, and maybe dry the car out a bit...........

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Mar 26^th, 2010, 10:04pm

Update on my leak in the front passenger foot well, I put some towels down in the foot well to try and soak up some of the water, and with the dry weather it has dried up. It's been dry for the past 2 weeks. In the past 3 weeks iv'e lost less than a 1/4 cup of water. So i was thinking it wasn't my matrix but maybe it got wet because of the snow and slush and rain that we had at that time. But it has been raining a bit last week and is still dry. I did clean my clack valves and they was a bit dirty so maybe that was the problem, But there was quite a lot of water in the foot well. ............ I'll keep an eye on it see if it gets wet........ cheers for the advice

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Thunderchild on Apr 2^nd, 2010, 8:17am

Hope you don't get the problem I have.

No heat so decided to replace the matrix. Managed to source one, well they made it for me after I sent them the old one, fitted it, replaced the thermostat which appeared to be faulty and all seemed well. Drove around for a few days to make sure everything was fine and the decided to give her a longer run.

Set off and had gone about 20 miles. Stopped and filled up with Autogas and set off again. Got about a mile and a half from the garage when there was a sudden bang and my left foot was covered in boiling water and steam. The whole car filled with steam as the water continued to splatter out and all the windows instantly misted up.

Instant panic cos now I can't see where I'm going and can't put my foot back down for the brake cos all the boiling water and steam is still spewing into the footwell. Trun off the ignition and haul on the handbrake and pray that I don't hit anything. Well someone was looking after me cos the car comes to a stop fairly close to the kerb without hitting anything ... result!!

Then the pain starts. My foot is absolute agony and as I take my shoe and sock off, skin comes with it, not good.

Anyway the long and short of it is that I still in lots of pain, can't walk properly and don't yet know when it will heal fully.

As for the car, it's sat on the drive and I can't make up my mind whether to take it apart again and see what actually happened with the matrix or simply scrap the beast. Maybe once the pain stops and I'm thinking more rationally I'll pull it apart then go after the company that made it for me.

And on that note... happy motoring!!

Tc

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Apr 2^nd, 2010, 10:07am

Geoff, that is one nasty injury. Hope you soon recover and get to the root of the cause. If you do start to take the thing apart be sure to photograph every step and preferably have a mate with you to verify your findings if it is the matrix which is faulty.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Mike Holmes on Apr 6^th, 2010, 7:03pm

Bluddy hell ....

Er, OK silly question time ~ does a non air-con model have a cabin filter, and if so, how many ;D

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Apr 6^th, 2010, 8:26pm

Update 2.... Since my last update we've had some rain and felt the passenger footwell, and it was wet again, so i don't think it's the matrix as it only gets wet after a couple of days rain, so i'll be checking the battery compartment again, i'm pretty sure the drain holes are clear but will check again. I'll be changing my gearbox oil next week so while i've got it on stands i'll have a look for any holes in the underneath... By the way is it safe to have the scorp on 4 axle stands.......... Cheers
Oh and Mike have a look at this .... http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cabinfilters.htm

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Mike Holmes on Apr 6^th, 2010, 9:09pm

Thanks I did see that, just wondered if it's the same or practically the same where there's no AC

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Apr 6^th, 2010, 9:22pm

Tony. If the foot well is wet then the likely culprit is the large rubber grommet in the bulkhead which carries the cables from the auxillary fusebox to the module behind the glovebox. Open the flap in the roof of the glovebox ands,if necessary, drop the glovebox down. Just unclips.
This (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/electrical/intbasic/CentralContModule.pdf) shows you what I mean.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Apr 6^th, 2010, 10:06pm

Thanks Simmo i'll try that at the weekend...........

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Apr 9^th, 2010, 5:24pm

Hello just looked at the grommet in the bulkhead as simmo suggested, and it was loose ( not in the hole properly )I've put it back, so hopfuly that was the problem of my wet floor, but i did find it easier to get to from behind the battery, unless that was a different grommet.......... Cheers

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Apr 9^th, 2010, 5:30pm

Tony, the reason for dropping the glovebox is to see if the water has penetrated that way and if so has it left the Control module wet. If the grommet was not fitted correctly that seems the likely cause. Hopefully a lucky escape. The 'black box' of electronics does NOT like water!.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Apr 9^th, 2010, 5:39pm

Hello i took the glove box out and i think the CCM and looked in the flap as you said, and all was dry no sign of any water...... Cheers

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by tonyboy on Jun 9^th, 2010, 8:55pm

on 04/06/10 at 21:22:28, Simmo wrote:

Hello just an update on my leak. Since iv'e put he rubber grommet back in it's place iv'e had no wet carpets..... Thanks for all the advice.....

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Jun 10^th, 2010, 6:38am

Glad you are sorted and pleased to have helped. Thanks for the feedback.

Title: Re: Heater Matrix: update
Post by tonyboy on Oct 1^st, 2010, 9:37pm

Just an update about the damp in the passenger side footwell.
It wasn't the heater matrix . it must have been the grommet behind the glovebox. Ever since i re-seated the grommet the carpet has been dry
Cheers for the help

Title: Re: Heater Matrix
Post by Simmo on Oct 2^nd, 2010, 8:21am

Tony. Just be sure the drain holes in the battery area are free so any water can get out the proper way. Mike ;)