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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Tyre wear Sorted
        
(Message started by: Chieftain on Jun 6^th, 2010, 9:43am)

Title: Tyre wear Sorted
Post by Chieftain on Jun 6^th, 2010, 9:43am

Noticed that both front tyres have worn on the inner portion, this usually indicates tracking, could this be due to the fact I replaced front springs a while ago and had marked on things to do to have tracking checked, sadly I managed to foget so is this a result?

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by PJDavis on Jun 6^th, 2010, 10:10am

Yep, wheel alignment is out. If you are wearing tyres more on the inside the car is too far 'toed-out'. I would steer-clear of places like 'Kwik-Fit' for my wheel alignment, the job is only done as well as the operator! I do my own with a run-over plate, and make sure your steering wheel is central when you get the car back. Another way of checking what way wheel alignment is out, is to run your hand across the tyre to feel for the feathering. If you feel the feathering when you pull your hand outwards, your alignment is 'toed-in'. If you feel the feathering when you run your hand inwards, your alignment is 'toed-out'.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 6^th, 2010, 11:09am

Thanks PJ, would not dream Kwik fit, I have a local garage that I trust and they love the Scorp. Another thing would this account for a groaning noise on right lock? as wheels being forced to adopt untrue allignment, only seems to have taken place since I did the work.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by PJDavis on Jun 6^th, 2010, 7:50pm

You'll need to describe as best as you can the groaning noise, by aligning it to another sound and telling exactly when it happens.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 6^th, 2010, 9:54pm

LOL very hard to do in words, only on right lock and it sounds more hydraulic than metal but it vibrates up the column. Never had it till the springs were replaced, have tried the removing air lock tip posted on here often but no joy. Might see what happens with new tyres and tracking fettled.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Pegasus on Jun 6^th, 2010, 10:07pm

on 06/06/10 at 10:10:41, PJDavis wrote:

Agree - I went to KF and made a hash of it, complained and the regional manager said they shouldn't have attempted it as they "don't do cars over 10 years old". However, they did send me a lot of vouchers as compensation for the hassle.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Jonnycab on Jun 7^th, 2010, 2:02am

Could be that the track rod inner ball joints are worn & causing the wheels to tow out ? http://smilearchive.com/s/contrib/sarge/TheSmile.gif

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by PJDavis on Jun 7^th, 2010, 8:56am

Are the springs seated properly in the turrets? If not it's sometimes more of a graunching sound as the spring is forced slightly. Get the wheel alignment sorted first. Don't be surprised if even after the wheel alignment is true the car still pulls off slightly, this will now be due to the tyre wear.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 7^th, 2010, 9:07am

One other point if I take the weight just of the font and move from lock to lock then no noise and no sensation of rumbling felt.

What a comment by KF "dont do cars over 10 years" why are they different? thats why i steer (even with wobbly tyres) away from them.

Thanks for suggestions once tracking is sorted i will update.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by PJDavis on Jun 7^th, 2010, 10:39am

Chief said, "One other point if I take the weight just of the font and move from lock to lock then no noise and no sensation of rumbling felt".

This would suggest to me that the spring is just not quite sitting correctly, or as also suggested worn ball-joints or track control joints. It has also been mentioned on this site previously, NOT to go full lock to lock whilst the weight is off the front for fear of damaging the steering rack seals.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 7^th, 2010, 12:43pm

Trouble is which spring, hard to tell like this, guess best thing is check them both out

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 8^th, 2010, 11:15am

PJ any tips or hints on what to do? or simple fixes (is there such a thing) do I need to remove it again and then replace, when you say not seated in the turret do you mean as a full assembely or not seated in its top cap?

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by PJDavis on Jun 8^th, 2010, 2:48pm

Is the sound like a door creaking only in a heavier sort of way? You could try taking some of the weight off of each side in turn, and turning the wheel (but not full lock) to try and ascertain which side is making the noise. Get someone else to turn the wheel whilst you listen. Whilst the weight of the car is on the road, (asnormal) if you're brave enough, you could get someone else to turn the wheel slowly and put a hand up and rest it on the spring coil to feel where the vibes are coming from. For the ball joints: Weight on the ground, car engine NOT running, get someone to rock the steering back and forth (from say 'five to twelve' to 'five past twelve' whilst holding the bottom ball joint. (try not to trap your fingers) Also rocking the whole car at the front from side to side (if your mate is strong enough) will help feel for the bottom ball joints and the Anti-Roll-Bar to Strut ball joints. The first method of rocking the steering will show up any play in the track-rod-ends as well.

Sometimes if you fit a new spring to a strut the top of the spring doesn't sit square in the rubber cup. If this happens the rubber cup squeaks like a new leather shoe! But heavier.

I also seem to remember that these cars don't like the front-end to be lifted full off the ground and the steering can be a bit graunchy, mine was for about ten miles, then it settled down again. Maybe someone else on here can confirm that and shed more light?

Peter.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 8^th, 2010, 3:24pm

Peter

Thanks for those tips, yes car door sound does seem to describe it well, will see what happens (once it stops raining)

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Simmo on Jun 9^th, 2010, 6:21pm

If the front wheels are lifted off the ground and allowed to hang for a while it is common for the steering to be affected. The answer is to turn the steering wheel from lock to lock a few times with the wheels on the ground BUT with the weight off them to enable the wheels to move without undue strain on the rack. DO NOT hold the wheel in the full lock position as that does the seals no good!. Alternatively continued driving will have the same effect eventually.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Jonnycab on Jun 10^th, 2010, 2:30am

If it's the strut top bushes creaking, then give them a spray with some WD40 etc under the top plate. Sometimes they can tend to creak a bit when turning at low speed (creak goes when wheels are off the ground). It is quite common & not usually a cause for concern.

The top bushes are pretty big, thick & robust & it's usually top bearing failure that causes them to wear, but if the top bearing had seized then the steering would be pretty stiff. If the top bearing had collapsed, then it would most likely cause the wheel to camber at an angle rather than tow out of line & I'd imagine produce a pretty horrific grinding noise :)

I suggest giving the bushes a spray & getting the tracking checked.....then go from there ;)

If the vibration you feel in the steering is due to the wheels being off the ground, then this can take up to 50 miles to completely dissapear ;)

Hope this helps ;)

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 10^th, 2010, 8:59am

Thanks for all replies one other thing though the noise/sensation remains in the lock posiition i.e. if you were to drive in a right hand circle the nosie would be there all the time, then goes on center steering. Will see what happens after it has had tyres and tracking done. No problem with left lock

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Jonnycab on Jun 10^th, 2010, 12:18pm

Wouldn't be the P/S pump having a moan would it ? :)

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 10^th, 2010, 4:18pm

Johhny thats what I thought because it only comes on at certain angle and then stays on, but why would it not groan if weight was off, would it be becaue it had no hard work.

if it is this is there a solution other than repelacment?

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by gozz on Jun 10^th, 2010, 7:56pm

The pressure relief valve in the pump usually makes some sort of noise when forced on lock,and strangely not always both ways,the sound varies from a hiss to a rattling growl,the answer is to be gentle.Some of my helpers force the lock on,they seem to think it will decrease the turning circle !!!
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Tyre wear
Post by Chieftain on Jun 10^th, 2010, 9:36pm

on 06/10/10 at 19:56:27, gozz wrote:

Gozz I think you have hit the nail on the head, I know the sound you mean and that is what I get when driving, and it is not on full lock though just normal steering but only right side.

Title: Re: Tyre wear Sorted
Post by Chieftain on Jun 24^th, 2010, 6:16pm

Well at last tyres sorted AND the groaning noise solved, it was f/l/h wheel bearing. The thing was it was not making bearing dying type noises. As for doing the bearing at home no way, it took 8ton pressure to pop it out, can just seem e trying that, still alls well that ends well.