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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Brakes spongey
        
(Message started by: Bobbit on Sep 20^th, 2012, 1:20pm)

Title: Brakes spongey
Post by Bobbit on Sep 20^th, 2012, 1:20pm

Hi Guys,
I have replaced the brake pads on all four wheels, after fitting the brakes have become very soft and spongey, pedal travels a long way,and I have to pump the pedal to get it firm again.
Anyone any ideas?
Cheers Bob

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Simmo on Sep 20^th, 2012, 1:41pm

The usual cause...and don't ask me why... is that when bleeding the system the jar containing the fluid MUST be held above the bleed nipple. ::) Another Scorpio trait!.

Read This (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/brake/BrakeBleed.pdf). Section 3 has the detail.

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jonnycab on Sep 20^th, 2012, 4:35pm

If the brakes worked fine before & all you've done is replaced the pads & not opened any bleed valves, then it's probably just the new pads wearing in & should be back to normal in a day or two :)

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Bobbit on Sep 20^th, 2012, 8:10pm

Thanks for that guys,will give it a few days to bed the pads in and then see what happens.
Cheers Bob

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Mike H on Sep 24^th, 2012, 6:52pm

on 09/20/12 at 16:35:32, Jonnycab wrote:

If the brakes worked fine before & all you've done is replaced the pads & not opened any bleed valves, then it's probably just the new pads wearing in & should back to normal in a day or two :)

Yes have just recently had new discs & pads put onto the back, was very 'soft' straight off, only just now is pedal starting to feel hard

HTH

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jonnycab on Sep 26^th, 2012, 2:14am

It's called the 'bedding in period'....the hotter they get, the quicker they 'bed in' :)

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Bobbit on Sep 26^th, 2012, 8:48am

yes brakes are just now started to feel like they should ;D

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jeff on Sep 26^th, 2012, 11:38am

If the rear handbrake adjusters aren't working then the rear pads will have to be brought up to the surface of the disc by fluid pumped in by the old foot pedal. Makes for a very long travel pedal - orrible.
I know...mine's at it due to the adjusters all seized up.

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Mike H on Sep 29^th, 2012, 11:44am

on 09/26/12 at 08:48:52, Bobbit wrote:

yes brakes are just now started to feel like they should ;D

There ya go. :)

Jeff are you the one keeps oiling them but they keep seizing up again?

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jeff on Sep 29^th, 2012, 9:57pm

Re Mike H

No, don't think so. I tried to free mine up once by copious delugements of WD40 (have since read Plusgas is better so use that now, not sure if any better) and much elbow grease action with graunchers but after a small improvement they have siezed again and I have a long travel pedal. Might rebuild a caliper off another car or from a breaker and see if it's worthwhile, but someone said it's a difficult job.
Can't be any worse than any other caliper, I assume. Did my Lancia ones once, they were beautifully made units in aluminium, very well engineered and a pleasure to overhaul. The only thing that let the side down on those, was the steel bleed nipple that rusted and sheared off so it was a major engineering exercise drilling it out. Always a barrel of laughs when drilling hard steel out of soft alloy. Seem to recall fitting an oversize nipple and getting there in the end. All that good design let down by a cop-out on the nipple.
It seems the calipers on the Scorpio is let down by an inadequate handbrake mechanism.

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Simmo on Sep 30^th, 2012, 8:56am

on 09/29/12 at 21:57:15, Jeff wrote:

Re Mike H

It seems the calipers on the Scorpio is let down by an inadequate handbrake mechanism.

Jeff, I can identify with the 'graunching' for sure. ::)
If you look at the 'exploded' views in How to do Things you'll see that there is a small 'peg' which fits through the wall of the caliper. It locates in a depression at the end of the shaft which holds the handbrake lever. It also fits in a depression in the head of the coarse screw which activates the piston. In other words it passes the movement through 90 degs. This is why you cant remove the shaft from the caliper without dismantling the whole thing!. Once there is significant wear in these two 'depressions' particularly in the one on the end of the shaft I think you've had it and only new parts will solve the problem unless you are a skilled engineer and can re-manufacture them. In short a new/replacement caliper. IIRC a firm called Big Red do rebuilt ones. :)
UPDATE: If you look at the first picture Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=admin;action=display;num=1267895657) you'll see what I mean. The hole in the shaft looks really worn. ;)

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jeff on Sep 30^th, 2012, 11:12am

Yes I see what you mean. I will check out the re-con ones, sounds like a more efficient move given my shortage of time.
Thanks for the tip off...

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Mike H on Sep 30^th, 2012, 11:16am

on 09/29/12 at 21:57:15, Jeff wrote:

No, don't think so.

Must be somebody else then. ;D

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Simmo on Sep 30^th, 2012, 12:00pm

on 09/30/12 at 11:12:41, Jeff wrote:

Yes I see what you mean. I will check out the re-con ones, sounds like a more efficient move given my shortage of time.
Thanks for the tip off...

Jeff. This (http://www.biggred.co.uk/contact.php) is the firm I was talking about. I've tried to look up calipers BUT that section of their site is being updated. I suggest you give them a ring. :)
There is another site Here (http://catalogue.brake-eng.com/index.php?action=nsr&part=CA551) can't find a price though. ???
This one (http://www.carparts-direct.co.uk/?i=480338&ModelDetail=FORD+SCORPIO&ii=490860) has prices.....deep breath....but there is a £40 refund for the old one so actually not too bad !. ;D
Finally....E-Bay (http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&_from=R40&_kw=BRAKE+CALIPER+fORD+sCORPIO)

Title: Re: Brakes spongey
Post by Jeff on Sep 30^th, 2012, 9:22pm

Thanks for your help Simmo, must say I don't like the sound of over a hundred quid for a disc. I do like the look of Bigg Red however, so I'll phone them as you suggest.
Don't think I'll bother with having the calipers painted bright red - this looks fine on a 911 or Jaguar XKR with huge great Brembo brakes, but our humble poky little pinchers are best kept out of site. Someone has painted mine silver blue (before I owned the car)...looks daft, they are unsightly at best so why attract attention.
I will try and report back soon. Thanks again.