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        General >> Give/Need advice to/from others >> Power steering again
        
(Message started by: ro284 on Nov 29^th, 2012, 2:13pm)

Title: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Nov 29^th, 2012, 2:13pm

I did start another thread on this, but had to leave it till i had an injection in my frozen shoulder, it was about the fluid leaking out, it all drained out, over 18 months storage. i took the engine under tray off, and it seems that it was the fluid hoses loose! one was very loose! the fluid had run down into the engine tray, however while i was ubder the engine looking around, i found a white wire unplugged on the back of the alternator! thats the rev counter sorted! but looking at the metal pipes that go to top of the steering rack, there are two sharing a clamp which holds them both with one bolt! one is very loose, i imagine these pipes have O ring seals, i cannot get a spanner anywhere near it! Is this obvious that the rack has to come off? Cheers Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Simmo on Nov 29^th, 2012, 2:19pm

Bob, I think you are referring to the item shown in 8 Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/steering/PASRack.pdf). I have a feeling that there is some movement here but it is ages since I've done one. If there is no sign of leakage around there I'd be inclined to sort the leaking hose(s) refill and check afterwards. ;) Keep in touch ;)

The previous thread is Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Problems;action=display;num=1352835643;start=11#11) should you need to refer to it. ;)

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by gozz on Nov 29^th, 2012, 7:51pm

Yes the pipes do tend to flop about a bit,as you say they have O rings under a retaining collar but seldom leak,if you need to get your 10mm spanner to the bolt to replace them,and are finding things rather tight,you may be able to gain space by removing the two rack retaining bolts and lob the rack down a bit,should you need to disconnect the column,there is just one clamp bolt to remove,not a difficult job.
Good luck GOZZ.

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Nov 29^th, 2012, 8:30pm

thanks guys, there is no sign of any fluid leaking anywhere near that area, i don't think the bolt is loose, i'll have a fresh look tomorow, and decide if to lower the rack. i fitted 2 new flexi pipes on front callipers, need to get the air out and get brake fluid, had a wake up call today, i got the car up on 2 axle stands, then decided to re-position one stand, so i got the jack to lift the car up higher, ( i did not take the jack handle key out of the valve) put my hand under to pull the stand out, as i moved back with the stand i trod on the handle which released the valve and the car crashed down onto the much lower jack pad! wham! dropped a foot, in a split second! that was very close, shook me up a bit! i now realise its best to remove the jack handle! :-[ thanks Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 2^nd, 2012, 12:41pm

I’ve refilled power steering, no sign of any leaks, also fitted flexy front brake hoses, With the tip about bleeding the front brakes thanks’ got 5 foot of coax able, pulled the copper out, and ended up with a tube, so that i could bleed the brakes right back into the fluid reservoir, instead of a bottle, worked well, so before i put the wheels on, is there anything else i could do? I can see the abs sensors on the hub with one bolt, but that does not seem to release the sensor, i was wondering if i should clean them or not bother, all sensors test ok, any advice (Pre mot,) please? Thanks Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Simmo on Dec 2^nd, 2012, 1:34pm

Bob, The front sensors will not come out!. All you can do is remove the large plastic disc on the inside of the hub and make sure there is no debris inside. Anything metallic will stick to the sensor and cause problems. The clearance between the ring and the end of the sensor is only thousands of an inch. If the ABS is working correctly the light will come on at start up,go out and stay out once you move off. If you have worked on the sensors you may have to drive it to clear the light in the first place. If the light goes out at start up and then returns once you get up to about 10mph it is likely that the pins on the contoller are faulty and need the 'Tompion' fix. ;) Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/abscontrollerrepair.htm). Just to update Dave's post he has done this numerous times now,it clearly is a common fault and indeed others have done it themselves. The fault code says the motor is faulty when in fact it is simply a poor connection. The simple check is to apply 12v to the motor and if it runs then clearly it isn't faulty. ;)

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 4^th, 2012, 9:51pm

Thankyou again SIMMO, when i took the car off the road 18 months ago, there was no problem with the A.B.S, but after all that time, many flat battery, in and out! the light stays on, it will not go out, all sensors test ok, i live in a small crescent i have no m.o.t. i need one soon, but i cant get up to much speed round the crescent, to re,set a.b.s would it be possible to run it with the back wheels off the ground? i don't want it to fail m.o.t on the a.b.s light! of course it may hava a fault on the a.b.s. it all seems to depend on driving it for a
while! :-[ cheers Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Tompion on Dec 5^th, 2012, 1:16am

All 4 wheels need to turn at the same speed to pass the rolling test.

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Simmo on Dec 5^th, 2012, 8:57am

Bob, it seems that there are two stages. The light should go out on start up.However when I had my front hub/sensor changed it only went out when the car was driven. That was at a very low speed as I drove away from the garage, easily achieved in your cul de sac. The second stage is IF it goes out at start up BUT comes on again once you get to, say, 10/15mph then it is likely to be the 'motor pin problem'. It seems that the motor/ABS system is designed to cut in above a certain speed prior to which, one assumes,it would not be necessary. :)

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 5^th, 2012, 9:50am

Thanks guys, The light does not go out after starting the engine, its on all the time, My mot man is ok! in the past he has been very helpfull, If it was to come down to the car being 100% in every other respect, will it fail on just the abs light however helpfull the guy wants to be? i know he checked even the tow bar electrics on my 2-3, I will check everything again, Cheers Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by lesterlad aka Rodders on Dec 5^th, 2012, 10:08am

Your Scorpio shouldn't fail on the ABS light YET as it's still an advisory as is the towbar electrics.

http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/car-servicing-repair/mot-changes-2012.html

Quote:

VOSA has now confirmed that the advisory period for the new test items will remain in place at least until the end of 2012.

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 5^th, 2012, 10:14am

Great, thanks for that rodders, i'll book it in soon, i am hoping that a good run might correct any proplems, or at least show up anything else that needs doing, cheers Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Tompion on Dec 5^th, 2012, 11:38am

I don't think that's right, the ABS light was already required to function correctly.

It's the airbag light that is to become part of the MOT.

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Simmo on Dec 5^th, 2012, 11:56am

I think Tompion is right too. :)

UPDATE: However.......having tried to check it out I came across This (http://www.motester.co.uk/Home/MOTChecklist.aspx) which does seem to bear out what Rodders says. The relevant part is highlighted in Orange along with others. ???

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 6^th, 2012, 3:01pm

Thanks guys i only just caught up with my thread! i took my son's honda for mot today, one of many things it failed on was the srs light! personally i would have thought it would be a requirement for the ABS light to be working for mot, i would feel happier if it was, but i have been round the block a few times! not very far, but the light stays on, i don't have time to do anything now, i will see what happens with mot tomorow, i don't expect it to pass! i do like things to work properly, i just ran out of time with this, i will have to correct it! my other scorpio packed up today, the serpentine belt melted because the tensioner bearing siezed up!
will update tomorow, As a matter of interest my now stand in died 2-3 estate has better brakes and acceleration than the 2-9! i am hoping that the brakes may feel less than a 100% Because the discs are covered in rust! cheers Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 7^th, 2012, 10:53am

Morning guys, Tompion is right! car failed mot on ABS, which is a fail if the warning light is on! as expected really, but there was nothing else :) so i have tested the sensor readings with a continuity tester, and got the following FL= 999. FR=988. RL=997. RR=402, :-[FROM this i imagine, or guessing/hoping it may be the imbalance between these sensor readings that is causing the light to remain on? however i don't know if the low one is the norm! or the other 3 are as they should be!! hoping for a direction really please, in the meantime i will have a look at RR,
Thanks Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by Mike H on Dec 7^th, 2012, 12:47pm

As far as I know 1st 3 seem right, 402 seems a bit low.

Also AFAIK the static test tests the sensors for continuity, the rolling test whether A. they produce signals; B. said signals match in terms of each wheel is same rotational speed. (?)

RR might have a fault ~ external resistance in parallel? Water in plug? Or just kaput?

BTW another thing that can cause the ABS warning light to come on while moving is low Voltage. Guess how I know ;D

This is because of not enough electrical power to work the pump. (?)

Also, I mostly tend to watch for the warning lights to go out before actually starting.

HTH

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 7^th, 2012, 1:13pm

Thanks Mike, i have been having a good look, ive traced the wiring to the sensor plugs under back seat, and to cut a long story shorter, there is a short in the rather poor wiring from the multiplug to the RR plug, :under rear seat wiring, both rear sensor are ok and give the same reading on under rear seat plug! i have proved this by swapping over the RL feed wire to the the RR sensor, and got good reading! so RR sensor is ok. but only ok when plugged in to the feed to RL, With RR unpluged there is a reading from it's feed wires when nothing is connected at each end, ie a short, so i will check the diagrams to see if the feed wires go directly to under seat connectors without any other connections on the way, if so it looks like i can rewire it!The multiplug looks a bit grotty, cracked wires etc. so will have to do repairs there. i am sure i have seen a diagram somewhere, but can't find it now, any pointers would be great, cheers
Bob

Title: Re: Power steering again
Post by ro284 on Dec 8^th, 2012, 5:15pm

Just an update, i sorted the wiring, to RR and now all sensor readings, are pretty much the same around 997, Sadly the blessed light is still on!any ideas please? cheers Bob