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        General >> Off Topic Subjects >> PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
        
(Message started by: invernessguy on Apr 14^th, 2006, 1:24am)

Title: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 14^th, 2006, 1:24am

On 5 April 2006, the Office of Fair Trading (OFT) ruled that bank charges over £12 are automatically presumed to be unfair in terms of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations. Unfair terms are legally unenforceable.

this means that all bank charges over £12 can be challenged going back 6 yrs in england, 5 in scotland.

go to www.bankchargeshell.co.uk

and www.bankcharges.info

i have written my letter tonight to ask for a detailed copy of all charges in the last 5yrs, lets see what they say!!

i hope there is enough to get myself a nice facelift cossie ;D

donnie

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Baz on Apr 14^th, 2006, 1:28am

Trouble is Donnie, they have now put the final nail in the coffin of free personal banking. I have a business account and have to pay many hundreds of pounds a year in charges. Charges for writing cheques, banking cheques, annual account charges, charges for putting money in and even for drawing money out!!

People have been moaning about banks charging for letters and things for years, but once the floodgates open for charging for personal banking regardless of wether you are in credit or not, thats when the real whinging will start!!

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 14^th, 2006, 1:32am

i agree baz, i have a business account too, but over the years, i have had LOADS of letters each charging me 25 - 38 quid a go... so is it REALLY free banking? my business a/c allows me a few minor indiscretions occasioally, but my personal a/c doesnt, so i am all in favour of claiming as much back from them as possible. after all, they are looking after MY money!

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by mr._floppy on Apr 14^th, 2006, 10:46am

You lot want to change your Banks ( or handle your finances a bit better ) , instead of taking money off me my bank gives me money every month, it's called Interest :-* ;D

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Baz on Apr 14^th, 2006, 3:42pm

Not on a business account they wouldn't.....and I doubt you will be quite so smug when they start charging personal account customers the way they charge businesses. If you have a business account that doesn't have charges, I doubt it will be like that for much longer..we are about to witness the biggest change in banking for a few decades if all this comes off and everyone except the banks will lose out

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 14^th, 2006, 4:42pm

well i am looking forward to it, as on my personal account i have been hit by over 3500 in charges in the last 5 years, and thats before i start looking at my credit cards.... I appreciate what you are saying baz, but you could look at it from another point of view like this....

I am a taxi driver, i get a call to collect you from your house, and take you to work, a routine run, you do regularly. After every run, you pay whats on the meter, but one day the phone rings as you are leaving, meaning you are late coming out.... Its not really gonna cost me much to sit and wait for you for a few mins, so i do. When we arrive at your destination, i tell you the fare, plus 39 quid, guv, cos you were late! OR we could play it the other way, taxi doesnt wait, and i bill you for the pleasure of not going anywhere? you choose?

Now, as a taxi driver, i wouldnt do that to any of my regular customers, but if i was a banker......

My point is, and im sure i have ranted enough, is that the charges are completely disproportional to the amount of effort used by the bank. It doesnt cost them more than 50p to computer generate a letter, but it costs 39 quid to you or me.

I am much happier paying for every service the bank provides me with, ie, cashing cheques, withdrawing money, etc, but not at the rates on my personal account.

donnie

P.S. I intend to use the windfall money that i will get from this, to buy myself a toy.... The best possible ultima 24v facelift i can find ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Baz on Apr 14^th, 2006, 10:40pm

It isn't for sale mate!!! ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by cossie_al on Apr 14^th, 2006, 11:11pm

To be blunt I have contested a number of bank chareges over the years and I would say I have got off with about half of them
Its just a case of being bloody minded on the phone or brass necked in the branch >:( >:(
I enjoy both >:( ;) :)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 15^th, 2006, 8:04am

cossie al, i have contested charges on numerous occasions also, and, depending on how i hae approached them, i also got off with about 50%

After going through ol statements, etc, i have found over 2k in charges that i can now reclaim. After paying, and thinking that money was lost, i cant wait to have a nice shuny 24v outside my house ;D the smile will only be greater knowing i have taken the cash off the 'enemy' ;D ;D

never mind baz, im sure there is a v reg out there with my name on it!! ;) :P

donnie

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Baz on Apr 15^th, 2006, 5:24pm

I doubt it....JohnV keeps buying them

Baz

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Lee on Apr 15^th, 2006, 5:32pm

on 04/15/06 at 17:24:07, Baz wrote:

I doubt it....JohnV keeps buying them

Baz

his name just keeps coming up ;D :o
how about a thread on car insurance

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Snoopy on Apr 16^th, 2006, 6:51am

NO ;D

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Fitzy on Apr 16^th, 2006, 8:22pm

It'll be a while before we can all start claiming back all those bank charges because the bank inquestion (ABBEY) have appealed against the original ruling on the grounds that they never recieved the original documents and under the current law they have to be re-sent all the appropiate paperwork for the bank to review then it has to go back to court again.

Even if the bank loses again it would be years for all the legal nitty gritty to be done before we could claim, this could either mean all charges are frozen or if they continue you can claim more money back.

But the OFT ruling on charges over £12 was only for credit card company charges and not the banks charges which was dealt with in a seperate case, in the bank charges case the judge ruled that some charges they hit customers with didn't relate to the inconvenience cause to them. ie, £39 failed D/D fee for being only £1 short for a D/D, then another £39 fee for an unauthorised overdraft when they take the first £39 fee etc. Again it will take sometime for the nitty gritty side of things to be sorted so we'll all have to wait to claim it all back.

There is one way to get back the banks and credit card companies which is what i do all the time and it is 100% legal and the banks and credit card companies have no choice but to pay up. And that is to start charging them fees too.

Whenever i have to contact my bank or credit card company about something which is there fault i state in the letter on in the phone call that i will be charging them £25 a time especially for letters, obviously at first they will argue that they do not have to pay, but if it has inconvenienced you and cost you time you a legally bound to charge them.

My brother in-law whose a soilicitor drew up a legally binding letter of charges (similar to what they all send us) outlining all my charges and this was sent by recorded delivery to all concerned. So far i have charged the banks and credit card companies nearly £1000 in just under 2 years. You'd be surprised at how many charges they don't hit you with when you have a problem with your account for silly things.

Sorry for the long reply.

HTH

Fitzy ;) ;D ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by cossie_al on Apr 16^th, 2006, 9:36pm

fitzy,
Any chance of a draft copy of that letter ;)
I like the idea of giving these types of companies a bit of their own treatment.
Got a big un at the minute with my good ladies mobile service provider

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Fitzy on Apr 16^th, 2006, 11:24pm

Not sure if i've got a hard copy of the letter and can't find it on the PC anywhere, but basically its roughly the same as the "Terms & Conditions" they send you about there charges, but amended for your benefit. Just copy what they have written about their charges and change it accordingly for your own taste as they say.

Having just read a copy of the most recent one from my bank and the part about their charges is all you need to use and change, just make sure you explain exactly what "YOUR" charges are and for what and that should surfice. Basically as long as you explain it clearly and precisely there shouldn't be a problem.

My letter just explained that i would charge them £25 for each letter i had to send regarding any problem with the account that was caused by them or any discrepencies and £10 for a 15 minute phone call, and £25 per visit if i have to visit my local branch to sort it out with customer services or the manager. You'll be surprised how quickly they sort things out over the phone when they realise that its me on the phone, especially when i say i'll go to my branch to sort it out.

Another thing i did was to include in the letter that all phone calls are monitored/recorded for security reasons in case of discrepencies later, this must also be stated to the person on the other end of the phone each time you phone them for legal reasons. Basically thats it.

HTH

Fitzy ;) ;D ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by sector-9 on Apr 17^th, 2006, 12:20am

Surely charging the banks couldn't work? They can charge you because you've signed a contract saying that they can if you break certain clauses. They haven't signed any such contract agreeing to pay charges to you...?

Darren

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 17^th, 2006, 10:06am

dont worry darren, it has been ruled in the high court, by the OFT that you CAN now get em all back..... go for it!!

donnie

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Fitzy on Apr 17^th, 2006, 11:22am

Darren

Don't panic mate, it does work. as i said i've charged them now for nearly 2 years and i've read about other people who have been doing it for many more years.

The way it works is simply that if the bank is at fault or causes a problem with your account and you have to take the time to contact them to sort it out, you have the legal right to charge for your time, even more so if you have a business account and your self employed.

You just have to expalin about your charges and make them pretty reasonable. When you make a charge against them just don't take no for an answer and keep pestering them for it. In the end they will pay it.

Fitzy ;) ;D ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by cossie_al on Apr 17^th, 2006, 11:26am

Yep Ive told a few companies for one reason or another that I am recording the conversation and its amazing the difference it makes.
Had a few telphonists refuse to carry on with the call and run off to get a supervisor/manager
It is fun listening to them squirm ;D

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Bren_K30 on Apr 18^th, 2006, 11:21am

Is it cynical or realistic to take the view that you guys looking forward to a nice windfall will probably be getting the 25 yr free road tax on your Scorps before you get the final chapter (and your cash) in this saga off the banks because

1. This is Britain, and 2. They are banks.

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 18^th, 2006, 11:09pm

well bren, it appears that the banks are paying up early, as they are getting charged 8% for the privilidge of holding on to our money.... also, if they dont pay up in a reasonable time, they are being taken to court, and if they still dont pay, the bailiffs are being sent in.... much as they would do to the man on the street who owed them money!

so, i dont think its gonna be a long running saga for payment, they dont seen to be able to do much stalling :D

donnie

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Bren_K30 on Apr 18^th, 2006, 11:28pm

Not very often I would love to wrong but this time yes

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Baz on Apr 18^th, 2006, 11:35pm

I am still very sceptical about all this. I mean these are multi-billion pound companies, not some tin-pot plumbing company from Wakefield. If it happens that a particular individual decides to pester and pester them for charges for phone calls etc. The Bank is quite within its rights surely just to say...."OK Mr "Y" your account is now closed and you owe us X amount for your overdraft etc. They then make it known to all the other banks that Mr "Y" is a trouble maker and should be avoided. Mr Y then has no bank account and is well and truly shafted. Just like certain people who can't get credit, mortgages etc. They then get taken up by these unscrupulous companies who will give credit to anyone..............at a price!!

I had a guy who worked for me up until last January who couldn't get a bank account at all. I even tried pulling a few strings at our local branch where my company has its accounts but even they wouldn't touch him.

I would tread carefully when threatening companies like these, they don't take it or lose out for very long.........

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by sector-9 on Apr 19^th, 2006, 12:07am

I thought that the govmt required all banks to offer a basic account so that salaries/benefits could be paid into it. Of course, said account doesn't offer any type of overdraft, loans, cheques or switch cards, but still...

However, in most bank T&Cs it says that they have the right to demand instant repayment on any overdrafts, loans or credit-cards you may have from them - they could use that as a threat (though they're more likely to just charge for ATM withdrawals, etc.)

The saying goes that if you owe the bank £100 they've got you over a barrel - if you owe them £100m it's quite a different story...

Darren

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Bren_K30 on Apr 19^th, 2006, 12:46am

Just a little sideline to this :- The only time I was ever offered a cup of coffee (on a tray with biscuits) off my bank manager was when I owed them, what was at the time, a considerable amount of money.

He said to me "Aren't you worried about this money" to which I replied "Not really, you're worried enough for both of us"

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by Fitzy on Apr 19^th, 2006, 7:12am

Baz

I understand what your saying but you as a customer have the right to apply charges and fees to the bank when they are in the wrong, and forthem to forclose on your account they would have to justify it to the Banking Onbudsman as to why they closed it.

Sector-9, your right most banks are now obliged to offer basic accounts to everyone, because 90% of peoples wages are paid directly into bank accounts. Yoyr right about the overdraft part, they can at any time withdraw this facility and ask for full pasyment straight away, but not on any loans or credit cards because as long as you are not in arrears etc,they CANNOT demand these monies back as they would be in breach of contract.

Cheers

Fitzy ;) ;D ;)

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 19^th, 2006, 10:25am

i have sent off 6 letters to individual banks/ credit card co's today. In the letters im asking for total disclosure of all charges applied to my accounts in the last 5 years, (under the data protection act, im entitled to all the information they hold on me) so im now gonna have to wait up to the maximum of 40 days for them to provide me with all the info i need to proceed.

donnie

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by sector-9 on Apr 19^th, 2006, 8:05pm

I believe they have to reply to your request within 7 days (though not provide the information in this timescale - 40 days does sound familiar for that), even if just to say they've received it and it's being processed.

Darren

Title: Re: PLEASE READ THIS (bank charges)
Post by invernessguy on Apr 19^th, 2006, 9:24pm

thats true, they have to provide me with a letter saying they are dealing with it within 7 days, they must provide the info within 40 days..... then the fun begins!!

donnie