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Title: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 25th, 2007, 2:41am This morning (24th) there were two fatalities on the M25, J28 over the Brentwood turn off. It involved...1 lorry...3 cars...& 5 motorbikes :o Both the fatalities were motorcyclists. Having accidents on the M25 like this are not uncommon...but to involve 5 motorcyclists is very uncommon. I don't know the reasons for this accident, but I can only make assumptions that the bikers were doing a high speed convoy that didn't quite turn out right :-/ It's a very sobering thought that a biker can die a much nastier death on the road than a motorist :-/ My question is....when a motorcyclist gets on their bike...do they drive the same as they would when they drive a car...i.e....obey speed limits & respect other road users....or does adrenaline take priority over judgement ? I personally think that the latter is the case. Bike riders have to be more alert on the roads, as they are the ones most likely to be hurt...so why don't a large majority of riders seem to consider this fact ? They break speed limits most of the time (never seem to get caught) & give the finger to any other tax paying road user that happens to get in their way. Certainly, there are many cases of car drivers pulling out on a bike due to 'lack of due care & attention'.....but I reckon a lot of bike riders should take notice of speed limits....as alot of drivers don't expect a small two wheeled vehicle to be doing double the speed limit when they look right, then left, then right again. Motorcyclists....it's in your hands as to how much you value your lives.......go with the flow, & don't assume that everyone else knows your next move ;) |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by dogma on Mar 25th, 2007, 2:56am [] []i couldnt agree more, i was a biker for years and i rode with sence, but i also lost a lot of good friends due to there own fault and fault of others. I look out for people on bikes but how many times have i been on the road when a bike under takes me at high speed, if id pulled over without looking he would of had it. Sometimes you can look but still not see them as they can just appear due to the speeds these machines now can do. My friend who is sadly no longer with us had a HYABUSA, this thing could do 190 mph as standard and he wanted it to go faster, if that came up behind you would you see it or would he have good enough breaks or control to slow it down enough before he and the bike becomes part of your car good subject mate, its one that touches a nerve jim |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by petehull on Mar 25th, 2007, 1:31pm [] [] Yes I totally agree, I think in most cases it's a case of the rider letting the influence of others rule the head, we have all watched the racing on Cadwell Park and Donnington etc but these people need to realise that the speeds used in these instances do NOT fit in with the conditions of everyday roadusing RIP to many of them ..... Pete |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by craig on Mar 25th, 2007, 3:24pm i agree to an extent,but IMHO the younger breed of bikers are to blame,the more elder,experienced "born again bikers" who have been diving cars (or 4x4's ;)) and then gone to back to bikes are a lot more sensible,they tend to be more wary and road "user friendly".... some of the yonger ones with no fear what so ever,really are suicidal sometimes...... heres a thought though,you can pass your driving test on a monday morning,and monday afternoom be drving a ferrari etc.... but now to ride more powerfull bikes (a hyabusa for example ;)) you have to go up in stages on tests.... a step in the right direction i think.... should possibly be the same for cars :-/ |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by sector-9 on Mar 25th, 2007, 5:22pm I used to have a motorbikelet and the only accident I ever had was somebody rear-ended me on a junction because they thought I'd pulled off and I hadn't. Mind you, riding terrified me (though it was a great feeling on a nice day with a straight empty road ahead of you) so I always rode like I wanted to survive! My instructor gave me good advice - if you don't make eye-contact with another road user then assume they haven't seen you. Darren |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by Kjetil S on Mar 25th, 2007, 5:54pm on 03/25/07 at 17:22:18, sector-9 wrote:
Very good advice! |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by v4-max on Mar 25th, 2007, 6:32pm the accident was on the local news, it was caused by a car driver [bmw] who forced a lorry to swerve and over turn the car driver has been charged with dangerous driving and driving witout due care no doubt he will get dealt with very seriouly, probably get a £50 fine and told not to do it again. |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by taliban on Mar 25th, 2007, 8:30pm couldnt disagree more jonny, ive ridden bikes and driven cars since i was about 20, im a fair bit older now (not quite simmo's generation ;D) so have plenty of experience. 'My question is....when a motorcyclist gets on their bike...do they drive the same as they would when they drive a car...i.e....obey speed limits & respect other road users....or does adrenaline take priority over judgement ?' the answer is simple, if bikers got on their bikes and drove as car drivers do they would all be dead. They break speed limits most of the time (never seem to get caught) & give the finger to any other tax paying road user that happens to get in their way. no difference to cars in that respect really, aqlthough bikes can often be assumed to be speeding due to engine revs (most dont redline till 15000) and race cans (which sometimes improve performance but are more often fitted because cars drivers are often blind and normally dont use mirrors, so at least they might hear us!) Bike riders have to be more alert on the roads, as they are the ones most likely to be hurt...so why don't a large majority of riders seem to consider this fact ? well, we have to be more alert due to moronic car drivers, but yes we are more likely to get hurt, and believe me, it does hurt! actually come to think of it, my left leg wrote off a mk1 granny that was in the middle of restoration once, thanks to its idiot driver doing a u turn without looking. Certainly, there are many cases of car drivers pulling out on a bike due to 'lack of due care & attention'.. fact; more than half of all bike deaths are caused by other road users as alot of drivers don't expect a small two wheeled vehicle to be doing double the speed limit when they look right, then left, then right again. thats the problem, they should. apart from the double the speed limit bit which is a dubious generalisation, how many drivers do you see looking 'right again'? car drivers seem to have the assumption that as there are more cars on the road than anything else, thats all they need to concern themselves with, the amount that havent a clue about other vehicles characteristics is quite frankly frightening, whether they be motorbikes, lorries, cyclists, artics, buses, horses, tractors etc, all of which have an equal right to the road. Motorcyclists....it's in your hands as to how much you value your lives.......go with the flow, & don't assume that everyone else knows your next move unfortunately jonny it very often isnt. its often been stated by motoring organisations, the police etc that the ideal way of reducing motorcycle accidents is to make all people learning to drive cars ride a motorbike/moped for 12 months first. please dont assume (as lots seem too) that because theres a motorbike accident its the bikers fault, as in this accident like many others, it was a car driver. lastly, i must apologise if my reply seems a tad angered jonny, nothing personal, but as a biker when i see threads like this i start to get touchy, however, im glad you posted it as it gives me an open and honest insight into how drivers (who've never ridden) view bikers. on a worrying note, i havent been on my bike sites for a while so hadnt heard about this accident, im now a bit anxious as my ex girlfriend lives over that way and i know she was going out on her bike today....... |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 26th, 2007, 12:37am Points taken Taliban...& very well put forward mate ;) I don't ride a bike...never have done...& don't intend to :) But there does seem to be a differing opinion on a car driver's perspective of the road & a bikers perspective of the road :-/ Cars must out-number bikes on the road by at least 10 - 1....so when you see bikers blatently breaking speed limits, then you tend to notice it more. Maybe it's a deeply ingrained jealousy that bikes are faster than cars & can weave in & out of traffic :-/ As Craig mentioned above...it's not the older more experienced riders that are at risk......because they know how to ride a bike.....it's the younger, inexperienced riders who are the ones that don't realise that a 1.5 ton heap of metal on wheels will kill them ::)......... "due care & attention" should be practised by both bikers & car drivers......but unfortunately it isn't :-/ Which is why I said that bikers have to be more aware than car drivers....because they are the one's who will come off worse ;)...... I know car drivers should be more aware, but the fact is, they aren't. Alot think they are great drivers, but aren't really, because they only look for other cars & don't consider bikes or cyclists, or even pedestrians.....jay-walking isn't a crime in this country & the pedestrian has the right of way over any vehicle :P There are also the mid life crisis/second childhood brigade that go & buy a big bike to try & re-capture what they missed out on in their teenage years ??? |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 26th, 2007, 1:01am Just noticed this comment taliban ;) "the answer is simple, if bikers got on their bikes and drove as car drivers do they would all be dead".... ....maybe that's why so many bikers die on the roads ? :-/ |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by martin_rowe on Mar 26th, 2007, 8:29am both the lorry and the bmw car went through the centre barrier, the lorry on its side over all 3 lanes, the bikes had no where to go. |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by fordnut on Mar 26th, 2007, 9:46am I ride a bike and drive when i ride my bike i ride to stay alive.riding a bike has made me a better driver also ,because on a bike you think more and adapt your style of driving or riding to the weather conditions/approaching juntions or roundabouts/distance to the vehicle in front of you...you get good and bad wether they are on a bike or in a car ( or lorry )..But i must add when im on my bike i can not stand the those cars ( mainly huge 4x4 's ) with those spinning wheel rims that make the car seem like its still moving even when they are standing still i saw one sitting at a junction the other day i did not know if he was going to pull out in front of me or let me pass due to his wheels were still spinning... :o |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by mazzy_j on Mar 26th, 2007, 12:30pm a nerve touching subject indeed here, having said that you dont even ride a bike then making the assumption that the bikers must have been speeding would be the equivalent of saying 'all cab drivers drive like idiots' having seen a few doing u-turns as and where they please, does picking up a fare take priority over safe judgement? as the saying goes, 'assumptions are the mother of all mess ups'... tali is absolutely spot on with his reply, and i'd certainly agree with making new drivers ride on the road for at least 12 months, at 16 i had a bike on the road for the 12 months before learning to drive, the experiance certainly taught you to be looking everywhere at the same time. this experiance i would like to think what enabled me to pass first time without a single minor, and have the examiner at the end say he couldnt find fault with my driving ;D im now 20 and have just bought myself another bike for geting around town on as the traffic is so bad, i would say that compared to 4 years ago i would actually say that drivers are more aware of bikers on the road, possibly due to the numbers increasing, or simply the area i live in (Boxhill is only 10 minutes away, or 5 on a bike :P) :-/ this topic shouldn't be a have dig at motorcyclists opportunity as they were on the correct side of the road doing the speed limit for all we know, the first thing i noticed was that 3 letter badge beginning with B which is commonly assciated with bad driving (although there are some exceptions ::)) causing the accident, with the accident resulting in the tragic death of 2 bikers. Quote:
i wouldn't go stepping out in front of me then!! @ Matt |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 27th, 2007, 11:10am Ok...I can see that I'm just digging a bigger hole for myself to fall into if I write anymore on this subject & maybe I was making some assumptions that may not have been true. I suppose I was writing from experiences & opinions & maybe wasn't looking at the bigger picture, but it's always good to know what other peoples opinions are on such a touchy subject. Opinions that you wouldn't know if you didn't talk about it :) Lets just say that you get idiots driving cars & you get idiots riding bikes & you get idiots who walk infront of both, & of course, you get plenty of idiots driving cabs ;) Matt....If you said "like saying alot of cab drivers drive like idiots"....then I think that it would be pretty close to the truth. Alot of cabbies do drive like morons, especially the ones on radio cicuits who are late for jobs......but that's another topic :) |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by scorpio_man on Mar 27th, 2007, 11:38am hi there can we all have a read of this post (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Advice;action=display;num=1143273574) by forum admin. cheers |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 27th, 2007, 3:39pm I would like to add one more comment to this post if I may & I promise that it does not involve slating bikers as a whole, just this particular one. About 2 hours ago, me, my wife & 2 1/2 year old (in his pushchair) were in Wickford high street waiting to cross the road at a zebra crossing. There was also a young mother with a pram waiting to cross from the other side. When all the traffic had stopped we all proceeded to cross. Unfortunately a guy on a bike had different ideas....he went around the stopped cars & proceeded to weave in between the pram & pushchair on the crossing, narrowly avoiding both....infact we had to stop otherwise there was a good chance that he would have clipped my little boys legs >:( Everyone, including people on the pavement just looked on in total dis-belief :o So what did I do....well I gave chase on foot, but alas, I'm no Lynford Christie ::) All I can add to this is, I got your number pal & reported you to the police. And if I see you again whilst in my Scorp, then you'd better hope that you can still outrun me then ;) |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by mazzy_j on Mar 27th, 2007, 7:29pm Quote:
[] [] Well said indeed :) As we all know its the few inconsiderate individuals like that biker who give everyone else a bad name, i certainly hope the police get in touch with him for some words. Matt p.s. Apologies for the :-X in my last post |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by scorpio_man on Mar 27th, 2007, 7:40pm ;D |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by dh_dove on Mar 27th, 2007, 7:55pm Johnnycab I think the answer to your original question was in the first line of your post..........24th March. Our favourite watering hole is on a crossroads with traffic lights on the A46 (popular biking route), we enjoy sitting in the window seat and watching the world go by over a pint or two of Abbot Ale.......... ;) It was very noticeable this last weekend how, after seeing very few bikes during the winter all of a sudden there were dozens of them.........ALL highly polished etc. I think every fair weather biker (and possibly his dog) was out for the first time last weekend........ Out of practice, slower reflexes and something to prove........a recipe for disaster :-[ I'm surprised there weren't more serious accidents........ DH Dove |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by taliban on Mar 27th, 2007, 9:14pm dh, you could replace biker with scorpio owner, or put another way whats the difference between bikers going out and meeting up when the sun comes out and a car owners group? Out of practice, slower reflexes and something to prove........a recipe for disaster I'm surprised there weren't more serious accidents........ out of practice, yep, i know that feeling, i ached all over the other week, and actually i find when im out of practice i ride a lot slower and my reflexes are all eager, probably a bit too eager, dunno about other bikers. as for something to prove, true for some, but an assumption about all. if you read down the posts you'll see that the accident jonny was talking about the bikers were totally blameless........ i think its a psycological thing with bikes, people always assume when a bikers 'down' its the bikers fault, even my mum has (and she loves bikes), was in the car with her last summer went round a bend, bike down, his mates helping him, no real damage or injury it was a low speed spill, my mum says 'ooooh going too fast'. i asked her how she knew that? she just said 'well they do dont they'. it turned out the road had been re surfaced and his rear tyre slipped out from under him on loose gravel. a bike copper also told me that cars are more likely to pull out on bikes than cars possibly because of their size. jonny im glad you reported that biker, theres no excuse for that kind of riding, unfortunately i see exactly the same everyday down the kings road, but with cyclists......... |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 27th, 2007, 11:58pm I'm glad we're all friends again ;D But I'm still on a witch hunt for this biker as I fear the police will not act without the statements of a hoard of witnesses ??? Don't worry....if I do spot him, I'm not gonna run him into a ditch or anything like that....I'd just like to overtake him so close that he can see my left hand middle finger in front of his visor ;) |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by dh_dove on Mar 28th, 2007, 8:13pm Taliban Sorry, perhaps I didn't make myself clear. We drive our Scorp and Jag week in week out, winter and summer. The bikers that were out and about last weekend were, in the main "fair weather bikers". It was obviously their first trip out this year.......unless they ALL meticulously polish their bikes after every journey they make........also most were what I would loosely call "sport bikes"........uncomfortable, built for performance, trick exhausts etc etc. Also they came along in threes/fours/fives......as a group. They were not off to a rally, the rally was on the A46....... I was a biker years ago so do know a little about bikes. Don't get me wrong, theres nothing better than a bike on the open road ;D , but I do feel that there are a section of bikers riding very powerful bikes (now and again in the good weather) who, perhaps don't have the skills to handle all the power that they have available. As a biker yourself you must have seen them???? (I know one personally........It's only a matter of time I'm very much afraid to say :'()) DH Dove |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by taliban on Mar 28th, 2007, 8:57pm unless they ALL meticulously polish their bikes after every journey they make.... pmsl the fact is, so many of us do! also, lots will clean n polish their bike for a 'rideout' even though they ride them to work etc. most bikes sold are sports bikes, they're not actually uncomfortable, depending on your size and bike model of course, but they keep your back straight, but i do find the pegs on mine are too high and make my knees ache. i sort of know what you mean about the fair weather type, but then if they're constantly riding? there is often arguements on bike sites about fair weather riders (im one myself now), they're often considered not real bikers, but motorcyclists, but, often the ones that can afford a flash bike and leathers etc for summer fun have money to spend and often do track days which improves road riding. as for me, i dont mind being fair weather, i spent years of no choice, riding through sleet, snow, hail etc. now i dont have too, i have a nice comfy scorp ;D if any of the bikers on this site havent done any advanced training, i strongly advise you to at least do the police bikesafe course; when i did it a few years ago it was less than 50 quid for a whole day, lunch thrown in, it really does teach you about road positioning, cornering, reading the road, getting the most out of your bike with gear selection etc. the day after i was on an early shift at work, i rode the fifteen miles without using the brakes (except for balance at lights), just braking on the gears, i arrived at work with a massive ;D |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by Spannerdemon on Mar 28th, 2007, 11:39pm I reluctantly sold my last bike last year. A 600cc Suzuki, which was capable of silly speeds. A serious operation has now made riding impracticable to me. I had bikes for many many years. Bonnevilles, BSA's, a Norton, and several Triumphs to name but a few. I also used to race two highly tuned Bonnevilles in the 70's. However there will always be bad drivers, as well as bad motorcyclists. The fact that I'm still around is that I don't drive or ride like a maniac. Like others here, I firmly believe that bikers have a much better feeling for road surfaces, distances and speeds. They are exposed, and know the dangers of being hit, falling off, or hitting anything else. I also know a few that really shouldn't be out on bikes, because they don't have the common sense and maturity to behave themselves when on these modern powerful machines, some of which do speeds that I personally think are plain crazy for road use. My wife and I were in the near vicinity of a major pile up near Aylesbury five years ago. We were at a caravan rally in a field right next to the accident. Three motorcyclists were killed, and two others seriously maimed, after a farmer drove out of a side road in his car. The motorcyclists were travelling (according to witnesses) at very high speeds, and probably well in excess of 120mph. When they rounded the long bend on which the car was emerging, of course, they were banked over, travelling in close proximity to each other, and had (again according to witnesses), been racing each other. They were unable to control their machines, and the pile up was inevitable. These sort of riders are an absolute menace, and they deserve all they get. That may sound harsh, but I always have more worry for the poor sod that they run into when they are out caning their bikes. The guy emerging from the junction was held entirely blameless. The accident was caused by the riders travelling at excessive speed, and riding dangerously. When the driver pulled out, the road was totally clear. It was only because of the manner in which these idiots were riding, that the accident occurred. The sound of that accident, the arrival of several helicopters, fire engines, ambulances, and police vehicles is something that neither of us will never forget. It was major carnage. really, really horrible. Talibans suggestion is 100%. The time spent doing Advanced training is well worth the effort. Police training is about the best there is, and I added to this by taking and passing the IAM courses for both Car and motorcycle. The extra road knowledge and skill you pick up is brilliant. I think the bottom line is this. If you have an accident, whether on a bike or in a car, you can bet your life that human error will be the cause of it. Blame is pointless, because the end result is the inconvenience of smashed vehicles, injury, and even death. THAT is why it's not worth behaving like a moron on the roads. ;) |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Mar 29th, 2007, 3:57am I bought the Brentwood Gazette tonight & it had a story about the M25 accident...... ....It was indeed caused by a 25 year old BMW driver, who on release from hospital (minor injuries), was charged by the police with 'causing death by dangerous driving' ::) I now hang my head totally in shame for thinking that the bikers may have been somehow involved in causing this tragedy :'( They were all travelling on the opposite carriageway (anti-clockwise) en-route to some bike fest in Belgium when the lorry & BMW careered through the central reservation. The bikers that were killed weren't young either....44 & 40....so probably experienced riders.....my heart goes out to their families :( If that wasn't bad enough, it gets worse.....do you know that there were people (stuck in the traffic) who were actually getting out of there cars & taking pictures of the dead bikers :o So many infact, that it started to hamper the job of the emergency services, as the police had to go around confiscating cameras & deleting the pictures :o It beggars belief that someone would want to have a picture of someones mangled body lying in the road on their camera :o They must be ghouls...... & you would wonder what other type of material they kept on their computer :-X |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by fordnut on Mar 29th, 2007, 8:26am that makes me sick and angry >:( |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by dh_dove on Mar 29th, 2007, 6:27pm Apologies from me too :-[ There's always a but.......then again nuff said. :-X DH Dove |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by julie_quaife on Mar 30th, 2007, 2:15pm what a tragic accident :'( it,s never easy hearing of accidents such as these and i am sure as general road users whether car drivers, bikers, cabbies or truck drivers your thoughts went out to all concerned as mine did. i am a car driver and a pillion rider on hubby's many bikes over the last 28 yrs although recently disability has stopped me riding pillion. being a pillion rider has helped me immensely throughout my years of car driving, it has made me more aware of road conditions for bikers such as the effect of manhole covers, potholes, tar lines, whitelines any of which could cause a bike to slide if they hit or rode on them, to be honest the state of roads nowadays gives me just as much concern in driving a car!! as i said in a previous posting on a/c i prefer to leave the a/c off and drive with my window open a bit not only for the fresh air but also to facilitate the easier detection of anyone passing me such as a bike. if i see a bike wanting to pass i will always move over if poss. to give him as much room as i can and i will always back off to give him more room in front of me(survival space) there are times when a bike has crept up so fast and i do not see him until the last minute and i haven't been able to move over, basically it is just good manners and common sense and many people do this thankfully. everyone should check their mirrors more not only for motorbikes but also for emergency vehicles, down here in cornwall you will rarely hear sirens especially in the penzance area, i noticed this when i moved down some years ago and mentioned it to some of the school mums i know, they laughed and said the sirens weren't used as it was a holiday place and it might upset/frighten the visitors!! regulations have restricted smaller bike powers and i get scared seeing some of these kids down here with no power to open up and avoid certain situations and them being hassled by other vehicles to move over and no curtesy given to them when they have to move out and around a parked vehicle which has involved the car driver behind them overtaking them at the same time!! in my experience bikers nowadays are a lot more sensible on the road but you will always have those who aren't and even these ones do i rarely find a menace and they tend not to last long!! i have lost many friends through no fault of their own in motorbike accidents and to them all i say RIP |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by ferretmobile on Mar 30th, 2007, 3:46pm M11 this morning, Biker whipping in and out of traffic, overtaking on the inside and he just missed my front wing........I flashed him to let him know that I was there and he gave me the finger. I see this kind of behavour every day. Its just heart stopping. I know when I see a good biker and I have every respect. I also know when I see utter disreguard for other road users and this is getting very common nowadays.I firmly believe that every day that I drive, I must improve the art of driving and to hone my skills. I still indicate when I manouvre the car...I have noticed that most other road users dont bother. I put this kind of anarchy down to the lack of coppers on the road. Ferret.....just my two cents worth |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by TiberiuS on Mar 30th, 2007, 5:09pm Driving home yesterday, straight road, doing 50 in the 60. All of a sudden a motorcycle swerves out in front of me to overtake a line of cars on the other side. I swerved and slammed on the brakes, don't know how I missed him...really put the :o up me. If my reactions had been a second slower, there would've been carnage there. You get good and bad all types of drivers, as with all things one group will start blaming the other. I don't agree with any kind of power or size restriction on either cars or bikes for new license holders but I do think the required tuition should be more thorough and involve the pass-plus. Also once the main test is passed the full license should be granted on condition that another, advanced course is taken which deals with adverse conditions, motorways, towing and things like handling in the event of a major mechanical faliure (blow out, steering faliure etc). Most learners spend long enough waiting for their tests anyway, once I passed my theory and mock practical test I had to wait for 5 months to get a slot for my full test, spending money on lessons every week just to drive around doing the same thing in anticipation of the main test so I didn't get out of practice. I'd much rather have used that time and money developing my skills into something more than my instructor was allowed to teach me within the provisional driving course. Some of the cars and bikes available now are so highly powered, and in the wrong hands can be as lethal as a high powered weapon. But, why should there be the age-related banning as with alcohol when there could be more awareness and responsibility taught in the first place. Regards, Bruce. |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by dh_dove on Mar 30th, 2007, 6:37pm [] DH Dove |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by tintin on Mar 31st, 2007, 2:38pm wasnt it the big yin that suggested a 1' sharpened spike on the steering wheel, pointing straight at the drivers chest? that would make people drive carefully ;D i reckon everyone should have to drive an older banger when starting (like my mini :D) it teaches good driving skills like not breaking on corners, making allowances for weather etc. and silly overtaking manoeuvres are not even an option. the problem with new cars is they take the responsibility away from the driver for driving well (cocooned in a quiet environment, with active steering and anti-lock brakes etc). |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by taliban on Mar 31st, 2007, 11:37pm yep, a bit like boring formula 1 tintin..... |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by taliban on Mar 31st, 2007, 11:45pm jonny, no need to hold your head in shame, as i say i think its a psycological thing, see a bike down and most people automatically assume its the bikers fault. another thing i thought about the other day which i find quite terrifying; theres approx 1 million ptw's (powered two wheelers) on the road, which is approx one seventh of the amount of drivers that shouldnt be on the road due to bad eyesight, which can be anything from needing a white stick to not wearing glasses.....OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by jonnycab on Apr 1st, 2007, 12:31am Taliban...I read a similar report a few months back, that stated that at least 25% of all drivers who don't wear glasses would probably fail an eye sight test ??? I wear glasses when driving & have often wondered why, when sometimes other drivers suddenly slow down after a road turning (couldn't read it from a distance ?)...or just pull out in front of you & don't even acknowledge you :-/ I remember a few years back when another taxi driver I knew failed the eye sight test & was told he needed glasses. He bought some, but was so self conscious about people calling him 'four eyes' that he never wore them ??? |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by julie_quaife on Apr 3rd, 2007, 3:07pm i'm not having a dig at you tintin but mini's have wiped more bikers than any other car that i know of, the main problem has been through a mini pulling out into the path of a bike, the main problem causing this type of crash was due to the low gravity of the car and in congestedly parked roads and on road corners causing low seated cars to pull out much further to see as they did not have the advantage of seeing through other car windows in order to assess the situation earlier. my daughter wanted an older mini to start with and i talked her out of it, she got a rover 400 in the end. the mini has always been a lovely little car and it is unfortunate that modern overcrowding of our roads have created these dangerous situations |
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Title: Re: Motorcyclists Post by tintin on Apr 3rd, 2007, 8:40pm no offence taken ;D my dad was a keen biker, remember well the road trips to the south of france with the BMW K100 and the camper van. he banned me from ever owning one, as we were living nr london. he stopped riding when a lorry rolled back over his bike in london traffic, forgot to put on his air brakes. :o he got off just in time.... yep, what is with the big tanks these days? im forever being hassled in the mini ! but never been involved in a crash, touch wood, or come near to hitting anything. i use it to commute through town ever day, 30 miles return trip. it all comes down to learning to drive well. i suspect the usual mini driver is the young lad with the silly centre exit exhaust, rust everywhere, and a cooper engine dropped in, who is always in a hurry. i suspect that is more the reason for the bike wipes than the visibility issue (i find its actually easier to see out of than the scorp, good big windows, and the silly mirrors make you always check your blind spots). i find i have a much bigger nose on the scorp, placing you further back at a junction and more likely to be blinded. |
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