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Title: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 18th, 2008, 7:53pm apparently the An event in London! fund is in dire need of topping up again after another mismanaged funding(this is endless).the national lottery is being raided for another £675 million to pay for the 2012 games and my county, cumbria is being shortchanged to the tune of £18 million to assist in this funding. This equates to £35 for every person in the country. as they are taking this money from my county i wonder if they would also like to take the new nuclear waste depository site that is to be built at drigg and site it somewhere like westminister or maybe below downing street, that would go down well wouldn,t it. apparently the national lottery dream number was supposed to be funding the games but so few people were doing it that the main fund is plundered to finance it now , it beggars belief that the lottery fund can afford this amount but it obviously can and just makes you wonder how much money the lottery actually makes and where it all ends up, now we know where most of it is going down, country to the capital or into camelots coffers. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 18th, 2008, 9:31pm firstly, welcome to the enforced world of 2012 An event in London!s, im so glad you've joined in to help out, for the past couple of years (since we won hosting the games) londoners have footed the whole bill so its good to have others contribute. secondly, dont have a go at the lottery, its got naff all to do with the lottery, why should the lottery or any organisation bail out a failed government idea....... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by TiberiuS on Jan 18th, 2008, 9:53pm Tali, I lived in London all my life until 4 years ago. And I don't like paying for it either, the phrase 'Jobs for the boys' comes to mind ::) I'm 23, pay all my taxes, don't sponge anything from the system and all I ever get is either lumbered with more taxes and a higher cost of living for no good reason or some soft, out of touch patsy telling me I need to do this or that or I'll cause global warming unless I go all eco and start paying more taxes etc... The An event in London!s won't do anything for London or Londoners (Millenium Dome, anyone? ::)), the extra funding won't make an iota of difference to the lives of the people who live below the poverty line in the slums surrounding Stratford in East London where the main venue is being built or indeed anyone else in the UK who becomes forced to contribute. It's just another grand scheme for a few more pampered individuals to become filthy rich :-/ Regards, Bruce. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 18th, 2008, 10:14pm quite agree tibs, i remember a comedian (forgotten who) who lives in london stating when we won the bid he just put his head in his hands and said 'christ, what have we done' |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by merseyscorp on Jan 19th, 2008, 1:10am Slightly off topic, but a similar thing is happening up here in Liverpool with 'capital of Vulture sorry culture'. 20Million shortfall & guess who's paying for it??? For the record I don't agree with other districts being shortchanged either. All these 'schemes' An event in London!s etc, seem to be only for big wigs trying to boost their personal C.V's. Those responsible for all these 'shortfalls' should be brought to task. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jan 19th, 2008, 9:44am On a similar theme, in the past 10 years the Government 'tax take' has doubled - you are left asking where has all the money gone ? ??? ??? ??? Still got long NHS waiting lists, roads in a dreadful state of repair, standards falling in education...I could go on.... Wish my income had doubled in 10 yrs :'( |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by pagey on Jan 20th, 2008, 10:28am Why don't we look at the countries that won medals at the last turnout, buy some more, award them the medals, tell them to p*** off and then we wont be robbed to fund a crazy idea that not many people really give a toss about except the little ugly bloke that runs London. Makes me rather vexed as well >:( Trev. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by welshwoofs on Jan 20th, 2008, 10:44am Newbie here... but had to chime in as the An event in London!s are one of my pet hates. Greece has been crippled with the debt of the games they held after budgets spiralled out of control (sounds familiar hey) and we'll be the same. What will the An event in London!s give us? Sod all. It won't enhance the lives of people living out in that area and I'll take a bet that after the fiasco is over the site will rot for a few years before being sold off for next to nothing to a corporation. Meanwhile every working person in the country will have been forced to pay for yet another mismanaged event run by a bunch of idiots (how can ANYONE on a project this big forget to include VAT in budget projections???). I, unlike many, actually do feel that the London 2012 logo will represent our games as it's amateur, over-priced, completely inappropriate, a mess and only has impact upon the pocket. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Scorpio_Mike on Jan 20th, 2008, 11:29am Yeah...that logo... :-[ Obviously designed by a committee...just wonder what they were smokin' at the time... ;) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by joe-satch on Jan 20th, 2008, 6:20pm hi,just to add a comment,the moment it was anounced that london had won the venue for the 2012 games,i think the whole country knew it was going to cost us all a hell of a lot of cash,and it just dont matter where the cash comes from...so long as it rolls in..personaly i dont give a dam for the games...i for one dont want it held here.. >:(. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 20th, 2008, 8:21pm personally i do think its all a shame really, the An event in London!s and athletics dont interest me much at all, but obviously it matters lots to athletes who spend their lives training for it, and kids who dream about being a part of it, then politicians, money men etc etc just ruin it by turning it into a cash pit (cash cow for some), political weapon etc etc.....i love the idea of staging the An event in London!s but everything that goes with it..... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 20th, 2008, 9:23pm if the lottery can afford that much think what it could do for the NHS.cancer relief, bh foundation ,hospices the list is endless(btw tali i dont do the lottery any more for these reasons , but they get me other ways as do you all ) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 20th, 2008, 11:49pm the thing is though Neil why should it? when it was formed it was not to be used for such things, to use it for such would be bailing out any government from their responsibilities to our health care that we have already paid for.... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 21st, 2008, 9:05pm i agree with you tali but some of the causes that benefit are ludicrous. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Baz on Jan 21st, 2008, 11:02pm Simple solution to the ills of the Labour Government? Vote Tory next time.!! |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by scruffygyt on Jan 21st, 2008, 11:08pm their no different to labour. vote UKIP next time |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by merseyscorp on Jan 22nd, 2008, 1:06am They've got a lot to answer for the torys. However, I do think they have a good chance to get in, especially round here (everyone knows what we thinks of torys ;D) Labour have had 10 years to fix tory wrong doing & still haven't come good. I think some ( a lot) of people thought the grass was greener when 'New Labour' come in to power. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 22nd, 2008, 2:38am As someone who has no interest in politics at all (I have only voted once in my 38 years when I was 18 just for the novelty) it looks to me like neither Labour or the Torys do a great job of things and never have... Things certainly do seem to be getting more and more ridiculous by the day, with the UK seemingly totally focussed on helping drug addicts, illegal immigrants, people who CHOOSE not to work, criminals.. you name it, the worse you are the more you get and we're spending an absolute FORTUNE on all this.. I for one would like to see a "fairer" system, if you're in jail you get food, water, shelter, warmth, made to work for nothing and thats it! no SKY telly, snooker tables, saunas etc... wheres the deterrent there?? Same with the unemployed and the rapidly increasing number on disability benefits... yes you will be housed, fed, clothed, etc BUT you will NOT be able to afford mobile phones, SKY, huge tv's, CARS!! or any of lifes luxurys, you will NOT be better off not working, not even close! I appreciate there ARE genuine cases but there are huge numbers of people living very comfortably in nice houses with nice cars who will just not work! I know loads of them and i'm sure you do too.. Now before the politically correct start jumping up and down here, I am NOT and never will be a racist (well I dont like you English much but thats allowed) ;) But a friend of mine in the Glasgow area recently when trying to get his 5 year old into a school found out that the TWO nearest schools did NOT use English as the teaching language!!(no the first language wasnt Gaelic either) I find that incredible that we even allow that to happen.. "English is the second language among children in 1,300 British schools" " It is estimated that the cost of educating a non-English speaking pupil could be as much as £30,000 a year. This compares with £4,000 for a primary school child whose mother tongue is English" Its costing us a FORTUNE!! not only that but we are churning out thousands of people who live here and cant speak English and never will!! Now when having this same discussion recently I was given a manifesto from a UK political party (edited so as not to show which party) and asked to read it and see what I thought.. After reading it through thoroughly I said if even 10% of what they promise were to come true I would vote for them in the next election! They seem to have the "back to the real world" mentality. Now when I found out WHICH party it was I was shocked, probably because of ignorance and the preconceived ideas I had about them all being Doc Marten toting racist Skinheads, yes it was the British National Party but go have a read at the manifesto, read it all and read it with an open mind. They are not (as I always assumed) solely hell bent on removing every ethnic minority from the UK yes it may well be all hot air but its hot air in the right direction as far as i'm concerned and it may just be enough to gain this vote in the next election.. http://www.bnp.org.uk/pdf_files/minimanifesto2007.pdf food for thought indeed |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 22nd, 2008, 2:46am Sorry didnt realise that post was as long :) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by scruffygyt on Jan 22nd, 2008, 8:52am well said that man! |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Tons_of_fun on Jan 22nd, 2008, 2:21pm Couldnt agree more Highlander.VIVA LE REVOLUTION ;D ;D |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Al_Sithi on Jan 22nd, 2008, 7:47pm I've just read through the manifesto and it is very impressive. Of course it might be bad news for me as I'm a British ex-pat living in Spain....mind you, a lot of the ideas in the BNP document are the norm here! |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 22nd, 2008, 11:05pm sigh, i read the first page; economy, i quickly realised that if the bnp get in we wont have one. i flicked through once; the prison bit was interesting and its something i always have a problem with; punish yes, of course, but you also need to rehabilitate, the bnp doesnt include this, but i agree with the chain gang idea. on a small technical note if a prisoner works they have to be paid even if its only a fiver a week, if not you've re introduced slavery. the death penalty, 99% of the time im against it for a multitude of reasons which i wont go into as it would take faaaaaaar to long, the 1% i reserve for people like stalin, bin laden, ex wife..... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by peteHull on Jan 23rd, 2008, 7:16am I read through the summary manifesto too, not being politically swayed either way I am of the opinion that some points are and would be good to adopt as a nation and some would probably cause more problems then what they'd solve. I liken it to going into a restaraunt, you read the niceley presented menu which on paper, all looks very good, however you wouldn't select everything, only what you fancied at the time and which YOU thought was the best (you could be wrong) you order your meal (Vote) then the chefs take over and you're commited, the chef has FULL control over what is delivered. Yes! when it arrives you have the chance to examine it, if there is anything found wrong you can complain (then the friction is introduced) you may be able to opt out but you would still have to proove the fault. (this could lead to a political war) You can see what I am getting at can't you? the state of things has got that bad that it would be VERY hard to find a suitable resolve, especially with the vast numbers of issues to be tackled..... I don't know what the answer is... I don't think anyone does. :-/ I'll stop waffling now.... Pete |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 23rd, 2008, 11:29pm the problem is its a manifesto and not real life and as such can look good on glossy paper, hell, even a labour manifesto could look good depending on presentation, you generally find that when you go through them properly they have more floors (flaws) than the empire state building. my dad is well in favour of ukip (i can only think that its an old age thing), my brother and me always have a laugh with him about it, a few years back on the xmas visit he handed us a 5 page print from ukip with the usual added comments of there you go its all in there, the truth etc etc. i have to say it was very well laid out, reasonably attention grabbing without being 'news of the world' cheap, in fact it was very well worded, but unfortuneately that was the problem, it was just words duping people, out of 5 pages one small paragraph was actual fact..... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 23rd, 2008, 11:32pm on 01/22/08 at 23:05:37, taliban aka Cheekyboy2 wrote:
If they are in jail they deserve nothing! In my world if you were in jail you wouldnt even get to see the telly and you would certainly think twice the next time you thought about breaking the law. How many crimes would be prevented if people knew they were going to get absolutely no home comforts for a few years ;) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by gozz on Jan 23rd, 2008, 11:40pm HIGHLANDER FOR P.M. And me a Sassenach anall ! |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 24th, 2008, 12:45am the problem is highlander that probably none would be prevented; society's that have used that approach (including ours in days gone by) are no better off, the prisons were always full, offenders re offended etc etc. i agree that prisons should be a punishment but i really dont have an answer, if you just punish, prisoners will just use their time to learn how to offend without getting caught, if you teach them better ways with plenty of rehab it seems to only work with a percentage, so god only knows. back to your comment about them deserving nothing if they're working then they do deserve a payment even if its a pittance, i mentioned its a technical point, but its also important constitutionally not to advocate slavery. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 24th, 2008, 1:10am Dont agree, its not slavery its prison and they dont DERSERVE anything. we seem to spend more and more time and money trying to bend over backwards and help people who will never help themselves.. My jails wouldnt be full at all, the death penalty would cure that :) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 24th, 2008, 1:22am This is my kind of Jail ;D Love the cable channels and the pink underwear lol http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Arpaio |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by TiberiuS on Jan 24th, 2008, 2:04am I agree with Tali here. Look at the one country which still has the death penalty and still has a harsh judicial system in comparison with ours, the US. Then take a look at their crime rate. With the US you're talking about a society which is ruled on a daily basis by fear, just like in the dark ages we used to be ruled by fear of religion and the existance of something which nobody could, or was allowed to, for fear of being sentenced to death for blasphemy, disprove.. It's like when guns were outlawed as a kneejerk reaction after Dunblane, what happened? I agree that prison should be a punishment, the insurgance of political correctness in this country over the past decade has done a lot of damage to society which wouldn't be easily reversed and I don't think many sane people would dispute that. But chucking every crook into hard labour wouldn't do anything to solve the underlying issues, even if it made the average Joe on the street feel better in the short term :-/ There's a lot wrong with society and nobody really has a clue how to sort it :-/ |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 24th, 2008, 3:25am It would make me happy yes and i wouldnt give them all hard labour, just make them work. A good lot of them would go down a big hole in the ground, there would be no paedophiles or murderers in there In MY manifesto I would also put gun turrets on fire engines with permission to open fire in self defense.. Same in hospitals, police stations, where people now think its ok to attack the staff. And!! any damages or costs incurred by people committing crimes would be paid for by the criminal or his family! None of this stuff you see on Road Wars when they chase people for miles and wreck half a dozen police cars with a helicopter in attendance then get 100 hours community service!! If you run and cause the damage and you or your family can pay anything towards it then you will. Any shortfall would be made up by time served ;) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by peteHull on Jan 24th, 2008, 6:56am on 01/24/08 at 02:04:31, TiberiuS wrote:
It's a DOWNWARD spiral, when it reaches the bottom there is a shock waiting and no one can stop it..... :-X Anyone can have a go a proving this wrong but as David Frost used to say "The evidence is there, lets go through the keyhole" ::) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 24th, 2008, 9:21am my god!! what did i stir up when i started a nice little thread about lottery funding,great reading lads ,keep it going. (by the way highlander , when you come down sarf have you noticed it,s a luvverly place?and i mean past carlisle) regards ,,,big neil |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 24th, 2008, 5:42pm Some bits are yes :) (i'm sitting in the car in Liverpool typing this) ;) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by pistonbroke on Jan 24th, 2008, 9:18pm This is a really good thread IMHO ;D I will confess to having voted twice in general elections :-[ The first time was on principle because I believed that it would make things better ::) The second time, I just voted for everybody because I had realised that they were all self-serving, nest-feathering t*ssers and it wouldn't really make a blind bit of difference ;D I will never, ever, vote for anyone who *wants* to be elected. Is there a better system? If there is, I don't know what it could be. Maybe we just need to get back to things like "principles" and "values" (not that I'd trust anyone who said that). The reality is it's about positioning yourself for easy money when you get found out - like Bliar and his job for J.P.Morgan ;) "Cynical" Dave :) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 24th, 2008, 11:16pm just a query highlander; do you per chance have a small black moustache? was just a thought ;D |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 24th, 2008, 11:18pm thats it!!!!!! sling highlander in jail.....hard labour et al.......in charge of a vehicle while using a laptop...... ;D |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by jonnycab on Jan 25th, 2008, 4:26pm I can't believe I've read this whole post & not got involved at all ???..... It's very unlike me not to at least write something a little self opinionated & controversial ::) Maybe that recent (3 week) bout of flu (shaking, temp 104, delerious, speaking in tongues etc), swiftly followed by a generous dose of the winter vomiting virus (cleans you out good & proper.....nice :-[), may have affected me more than I thought :-/ So if I haven't offended anyone, then I do apologize & hopefully I'll be back to normal again soon :) ......Just off to make those nice jehovahs witnesses a cup of tea & then flick through a few back issues of watchtower..... :D |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 25th, 2008, 9:16pm stuart , that means you pass carlisle going home , we must meet for a cup one day, |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 26th, 2008, 5:32pm Yep i pass there all the time, the Asda at the A7 roundabout is my fuel stop :) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by merseyscorp on Jan 27th, 2008, 1:04am Hope you enjoyed lovely Liverpool Highlander?? ;D Must agree therewith the prisons. However, I think fear is the way forward for these kids, simply because there is none now. These delinquent kids have no fear in the cities, they're ruling the streets with no deterrent. Taxpayers are scared of walking the streets they are paying for & People are living in fear due to religion still today at home & abroad & these people inciting hatred through religion should be executed with immediate effect. Secondly, surely building more basic prisons would be better to keep criminals detained for longer periods? Prison should mean just that. Just enough to survive. Once someone has interfered with another persons Human rights (which there are too many of) the perpitrator should lose all their rights. Read the BNP manifesto a long time ago, on paper it's great! Just a pity that they would probably not ever get into power, due to do-gooders, people who listen to too much rumour rather than actual fact & people who are creatures of habit, who are scared into looking at something different. But in the same breath, there's nothing to say that if they did get into power, they would actually deliver. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by tintin on Jan 27th, 2008, 10:49am my issue would be the likelihood of delivery, its easy to promise what people want to hear, but they seem to be giving a lot of money away without mentioning where its coming from. they have taken the common gripes of the common man, and written down what they think people want to hear without thinking if it would actually work. a 1st year politics student could do the same. favouring local business stifles economy (hence the shift away from that model in France), given GB is pretty much reliant on foreign investors, that could spell disaster for the country. the jail stuff sounds good on paper, but if the guy in america's model is so effective, why is his prison still full? all it is doing is being mean to people without curing the problem. the other worry is all the stuff they dont mention in manifesto..... absolute power handed to the PM (so they can write laws on a whim), hatred towards gays, discrimination against foreign people (even those born here!), they dont even acknowledge the Holocaust happened ??? we all know that GB has issues with corporal punishment, youths, immigration etc, but i dont think these guys have the answers. they are just a racist, bigotted group of people that have pretended to "reform" to win votes, so handing absolute power to themselves. a dangerous group, if unlikely to succeed..... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by TRACEYS_LIMO on Jan 27th, 2008, 11:50am :o bring back the cane |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by big_neil on Jan 29th, 2008, 2:16pm p.m me stuart and i,ll meet you one day in asda for a cuppa, it,s only a mile from me. |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Jan 29th, 2008, 5:20pm i've been thinking about this topic a lot lately; today, as i was driving my bus along brixton road i was trying to make a mental note of the amount of people out and about, but just generally hanging around with nothing to do as they are unemployed except buying and selling crack cocaine, stolen goods etc. i know the area is multicultural but it did strike me the amount of ethnic types that are just hanging around on the streets, i then realised that prison/punishment really is not the answer, nor is enforced labour or any form of work. what we, or rather society and communities must do is to inject vast amounts of effort and time into these people, obviously inner city boroughs have very limited resources therefore county boroughs should be made to subsidise community schemes in the inner cities....... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Jan 29th, 2008, 7:01pm Well in the interest of a good debate I think thats testicles! Isnt that what we are doing now and have been trying to do for years?? Why throw more money at people who wont help themselves?? We would like to believe everyone just neds that help up and they will become model citizens but the reality is that these people are laughing at us for giving them everything they want and supporting them and have no intention of changing! I'd hang the lot of them and start with all the bus drivers ;) |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Al_Sithi on Feb 1st, 2008, 3:12pm I have the solution to unemployment- simply make Mp's employ them as 'researchers' |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by taliban aka Cheekyboy2 on Feb 1st, 2008, 6:19pm i think the 'shires' etc should help out a lot lot more, setting up drugs hostels etc in country towns would help get crack heads etc away from the tormented inner cities...... |
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Title: Re: this makes me very angry Post by Highlander on Feb 1st, 2008, 9:26pm lol }{ |
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