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        General >> Problems >> towing
        
(Message started by: gary1 on Jun 6^th, 2006, 8:19pm)

Title: towing
Post by gary1 on Jun 6^th, 2006, 8:19pm

Hi i hope sombody can help me with this. I have a 1997 2.3 scorpio estate with self leveling suspension.I will be towing a trailer and would like to use a tow bar cycle carrier for 4 bikes as well.The max towing weight is 2000kg so that is no problem but the down ward weight on the tow ball is only 75 kg.( as ford hand book) What would happen if the down ward weight was exceeded.
GARY

Title: Re: towing
Post by Kjetil S on Jun 6^th, 2006, 8:32pm

I'm no expert, but my guess is that it could affect the steering and stability as the front wheels won't grip as well as they used to. How much are you planning on loading it?

Title: Re: towing
Post by gary1 on Jun 6^th, 2006, 8:38pm

the total down ward weight would be about 105kg.i thought with self leveling suspension the the level of the car remains the same so i would not loose grip at the front.
GARY

Title: Re: towing
Post by Kjetil S on Jun 6^th, 2006, 8:43pm

The self levelling suspension won't work. Think 'seesaw' ;)

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 6^th, 2006, 9:04pm

what sort of trailor are you towing cant you put bikes on trailor

here is an easy way to check tow-hitch weight

if you get a set of bathroom scales a 6in sq bit of wood and a 2x2 about 18in long put the 2 bits of wood on the scales and reset to zero

if you put scales under tow-hitch the 6in sq wood on scales the the 2x2 upright on scales and inside of tow-hitch what it reads on scales is the towball weight (downward pressure)

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 6^th, 2006, 9:05pm

ps

i tow a 1200kg caravan with my 2.9 12v ultima and towball weight is 70kg

Title: Re: towing
Post by Spannerdemon on Jun 6^th, 2006, 9:08pm

Hi Gary. We tow a 17' Caravan with our Ultima 2.9 12v, and you really don't want to exceed the nose weight.

Kjetil is absolutely right. It's not worth the risk, as if you had to brake suddenly, your whole steering geometry will be affected. If I was doing this, I'd put a couple of the bikes on the roof to reduce the towball noseweight loading.

Noseweight is quite critical, especially in damp, wet slippery conditions......but you really don't want to find out the hard way. Neither will your family.

You've got a bit more latitude with a caravan, as you can move weight around within the van to achieve a sensible load. Putting heavier items over the main axle, and not carrying water etc.

Don't risk it............not worth it. :)

Title: Re: towing
Post by Spannerdemon on Jun 6^th, 2006, 9:11pm

Another Caravanner.....Hi Smiffy!

:)

Title: Re: towing
Post by gary1 on Jun 6^th, 2006, 9:38pm

Hi, Thanks for all your replies.i will not be exceeding the tow ball weight now.I have a trailer tent so can not put bikes on top incase the tent gets damaged . I have a big roof box on the car so i will have to take only 2 bikes on the tow ball for my daughters and me and the wife will just have to sit on site sun bathing drinking wine.
GARY ;D 8) ;D

Title: Re: towing
Post by sector-9 on Jun 6^th, 2006, 11:21pm

Technically exceeding the nose-weight limit at the ball could bend or damage the bracket or mounting points. It'd have to be seriously overloaded for that to happen, but it could easily overload the rear axle weight limit, especially if the car is fully laden anyway.

If you overload the axle then the suspension won't be able to cope and may not be able to level itself, which will cause handling and stability problems. Also tyres are load rated for a given pressure and these could be overloaded with the danger of a blowout.

Apparently the recommended nose-weight is 7% of the weight of the trailer - it shouldn't be an issue for you unless you're towing >1 ton loads or have a bracket mounted bicylce carrier as well.

Darren

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 7^th, 2006, 3:07am

the ball weight is 75kg max for all other towing data

press here (http://www.cuddles.abelgratis.net/ford.htm#granada94) just scroll down a bit for scorpio

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 7^th, 2006, 3:15am

on 06/06/06 at 21:11:06, Spannerdemon wrote:

Another Caravanner.....Hi Smiffy!

:)

hi spannerdemon

yup im another vanner only had my 2.9 12v a few week
just had towbar fitted with twin leccy & new rad plus exhaust gaskets so it going to get tried very shortly

had a frontera for a few year but my wife who is disabled found it a struggle to get in so now ive gone for some comfort

i help run a vanning site here http://www.talktouring.co.uk

pop in and have a look

Title: Re: towing
Post by Spannerdemon on Jun 7^th, 2006, 5:13am

I'll do that a bit later. Just off to work.

Thanks for that. We had a Volvo 940 GLE Turbo Saloon for several years, which was the best tow car I've ever owned. Absolute workhorse, and I'd have another tomorrow.

:D

Title: Re: towing
Post by Paulus on Jun 7^th, 2006, 11:04am

I worked (very briefly) at Swift Caravans. 75Kg is the industry standary target for the tow-bar weight is 75Kg - primarily for vehicle stability.

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 7^th, 2006, 1:02pm

on 06/07/06 at 11:04:45, Paulus wrote:

I worked (very briefly) at Swift Caravans. 75Kg is the industry standary target for the tow-bar weight is 75Kg - primarily for vehicle stability.

paul

i always check my nose weight before i go away with van
my van has an overall length of 7.3mts

as for the caravan industry aiming for 75kg ive known them to come out of factory at anywere between + or - 25kg

Title: Re: towing
Post by Paulus on Jun 7^th, 2006, 1:17pm

It is only a guideline...very rarely met.

Title: Re: towing
Post by gary1 on Jun 7^th, 2006, 4:04pm

Hi paulus can you go over the 75kg limit and by how much and still have stability. The 75kg is only the industry guide line.
Gary

Title: Re: towing
Post by john_smiffy on Jun 7^th, 2006, 4:13pm

the 75kg on the tow ball is fords rating for there car
so why try exceeding the towball/hitch limit

ive been vanning for years and have seen some accidents that were down to people not getting car&van balanced

if the caravan hitch is 75kg and the towball weight is 100kg you still cannot exceed 75kg for hitch

if you have an accident and its proved you exceeded you limit i bet you the insurance will use it as a get out

Title: Re: towing
Post by Paulus on Jun 7^th, 2006, 6:22pm

Insurance....good point.

In the last three weeks, I have seen two overturned caravans - one on the M40, the other on the M5. the one on the M5 ended up with a Smart car on it's side too. Not very nice to see