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        General >> Problems >> Weld or not to Weld????
        
(Message started by: derekne on Jul 8^th, 2006, 6:08pm)

Title: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 8^th, 2006, 6:08pm

Are we sitting comfortably then I will begin again. ::)
As I got my car back from the clutch ect it was 7pm... My friend who sorted it out said. He would sort the blowing from the cat to the manifold. Join in the exhaust. As it was louder than normal.
It needs a gasket he thought he said he would do it. When he comes back from holiday. As he is away for 2-3 weeks.
Ok I thought its not too bad. However the next day it got louder and louder. ??? My MPG also dropped to 20 and petrol was guzzeling.
I cant wait I must get this done.
So this morning I went to exhaust specialist in Gateshead. They said it sounds like a gasket. From cat to manifold. I said can you supply one no its a dealers type we havent any.
Off to ford pattersons scotswood road. "Nope we havent any". "There discontinued mate" he said.
I will see if anyone else has them in the north east. :-/
I traveld to the ford at silverlink 10 miles away. They have got two left. How much please I said................. £10-00. :o :o :o I couldnt beleive it I made him check and re check.
So went to the exhaust place again.. ..Your going to love this....

They took the heat sheild of the passenger side. and hey BOBS YOUR UNCLE!!! :o :o :o
What stares back at us ???
A d**n cracked manifold :'(
Its massive the crack goes right accross horizontaly.
The guy looked at me and said. You will need more than that seal mate. I looked at the seal in my hand. Then asked can you help. Not today mate Monday it will have to come off to weld it. As it may be cracked underneith too. How much? My lip quivered as I asked. :-[ £45.00.
So do I get it welded or do I look for a second hand one.
What do you think guys and gals Ive not come accross this before?
When will this end :(

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by Paul B on Jul 8^th, 2006, 6:14pm

The passenger side manifold on mine cracked a while back. I changed that for a 2nd hand one and thats the route I'd recommend. Its cheaper than welding too by the sound of it.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/PCBoulton/Manifold1.jpg

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 8^th, 2006, 6:36pm

Just took these pictures.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y201/derekne/manifold2.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y201/derekne/manifold4.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y201/derekne/100_0147.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y201/derekne/manifold.jpg

Can anyone tell me if this is tap and dyed? Is there a bung in this nut with the pipe? Does it just unscrew? Is there anything I need to watch out for when swaping over?

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by scorpio_man on Jul 8^th, 2006, 8:15pm

hi there

getting the egr pipe off can be a pain. when my manifold cracked, i got a new pipe (about £45). second hand manifolds are about the same. the 2.0 & 2.3 are just about the same (egr pipe is a bit different).

hth

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 8^th, 2006, 8:24pm

Hello
Can you tell me where you got your pipe from was it internet or local? If it was local are you far from myself? Tyne and wear.
Thank you for your posts.

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by scorpio_man on Jul 8^th, 2006, 8:29pm

hi there

i got the pipe from www.fordpartsuk.com. manifold from one of the online partfinders (can't remember who).

hth

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by sector-9 on Jul 8^th, 2006, 9:11pm

Will exhaust cement or fire putty not work? A s/hand unit would possibly be cheaper and certainly easier - you can fit it yourself - but how long would it last? Then again, how long would yours last if welded?

Darren

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 8^th, 2006, 9:20pm

The welds are supposed to last a long time. However the heat off the welding. Is supposed to weaken the surrounding manifold as the weld is done. (So ive been told)
Now many may say my weld is ok and so is my manifold. However my car burns at a higher temp than most on here. As im burning LPG (GAS). So my manifold has got to be a strong one. With very little weakness.
Now as for the putty cement repair stuff I have just been doing some homework on this site. The manuals state no putty or fixing compound is to be used what so ever at any time infront of the C.A.T??? Dont ask why not so sure but thats what it says.

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/exhaust/exhaustcat16v.pdf
Scroll down to section 13.
There isnt anything that really shows or tells spacificly how to undoo the manifold. Just the exhaust (underneith) Also the C.A.T.S. Not a sausage on the manifold that I can see.
Thank you for your emails ;)

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by sector-9 on Jul 8^th, 2006, 10:25pm

The reason you are told not to use sealants, etc. upstream of the cat is because if it should break off it will enter the matrix and block it. Obviously as you are removing the manifold this is less of a risk as you should be able to remove any excess inside to reduce the chance of that happening. You can use a blowlamp to heat the manifold and harden the cement before refitting it to the car.

I'd certainly be tempted to try it - a few hours and a £3.50 tube of exhaust cement may well be enough to get you going on a semi-permanent basis - or at least until you find a good s/hand manifold!

Darrem

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by Highlander on Jul 8^th, 2006, 11:08pm

i have a good manifold from a 2.0 16v available for the cost of the postage if its any good Derek

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 10^th, 2006, 7:50am

on 07/08/06 at 23:08:14, Highlander wrote:

i have a good manifold from a 2.0 16v available for the cost of the postage if its any good Derek

Hello thank you for your kind offer.Is it the passenger side? Is the 2.0 the same as 2.3 DOHC?How much do you estimate the postage to be please I know it will be heavy.
Send me a pm if you wish.
Im going to try and sorce out how much at fordparts. For a second hand one in an hours time.

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by Spannerdemon on Jul 10^th, 2006, 9:41am

I've used a product called Thermosteel for years, and never, ever had a problem with it.

It's an epoxy based product which is specifically made for very high temperatures. Well worth a try.
I've used it on its own, and also with perforated alloy patches. Once it's on, it will probably outlast the life of the car. Really S**T hot stuff.

Can't remember where I got the last lot, but it's something I always keep in the garage. I've found you a site where you can get it though. I see they now also do a 'normal' steel one too. but if it's for the manifold, personally I'd go for the Thermosteel.

http://www.vintagetractorspares.co.uk/Tractor%20Parts/Pages/Allis%20B.2006.pdf

Hope this helps you out. Glad you got your clutch sorted out too, but I can't see any of us using that Mr Clutch outfit.

All the best. :)

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by derekne on Jul 10^th, 2006, 12:54pm

Hello and thanks again.
I tell you what these manifolds are almost impossible to get hold of. ???
I have ben to 5 scrap yards and all of them say.That they get them off the car. However every single one so far has already been cracked. :o
I have now dropped the car off for welding until I get a hold of a 2.3 manifold. As below I was greatfully informed.About the 2.0. Thanks all.

hi there
second hand manifolds are about the same. The 2.0 & 2.3 are just about the same (egr pipe is a bit different).

hth

on 07/10/06 at 09:41:48, Spannerdemon wrote:

Hope this helps you out. Glad you got your clutch sorted out too, but I can't see any of us using that Mr Clutch outfit.

All the best. :)

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by mazzy_j on Jul 10^th, 2006, 1:24pm

Mr Saville has some, i'm pretty sure he had one went i went round to pick some bits up. Word of warning, he is known for being on the pricey side of things...

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FORD-SCORPIO-ULTIMA-EXHAUST-MANIFOLD-2-0L-2-3L_W0QQitemZ4642730585QQihZ002QQcategoryZ21654QQcmdZViewItem

Matt

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by Highlander on Jul 10^th, 2006, 3:11pm

I've bought whole Scorps for less than that!! ;)

Postage will be around £10 ish I would reckon Derek

Title: Re: Weld or not to Weld????
Post by Dave2302 on Jul 10^th, 2006, 7:30pm

I have been welding cast for years, with no adverse effects and they end up just as good as original. Longevity does depend on the quality of the original casting, but most manifolds are ok. The only thing to do is to thoroughly heat the manifold as hot as you can get it and make sure to get a good penetration. Regards, Dave