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        General >> Problems >> Idle problem.
        
(Message started by: Simmo on Jul 20^th, 2006, 2:33pm)

Title: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Jul 20^th, 2006, 2:33pm

Have recently experienced problems with the idle on my 2.0lt 16v. On dipping the clutch,for example ,at a junction,the revs will fall to about 500 or lower and occasionally will stall. Stall is much more likely if Air con is running. Have cleaned and swopped the IACV but no change. Injector cleaner has been added and the fuel filter renewed. All wiring seems sound. No sign of air leaks,MAF cleaned and all connections checked for security. Any ideas where I go from here please?.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Dave on Jul 20^th, 2006, 2:52pm

It may be worth checking that the throttle body and butterfly valve(s?) are clean, along with any throttle cable return springs etc.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Jul 20^th, 2006, 3:16pm

Thanks Dave, they've previously been well dosed with carb cleaner and externally the linkage has been cleaned and lubricated.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Dave on Jul 20^th, 2006, 3:17pm

Not familiar with the 2.0 but could it be something in the tps area, similar to this:

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/obd2scan9.htm

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by sector-9 on Jul 20^th, 2006, 9:36pm

You could try pulling off the vacuum hose from the EGR valve diaphragm - don't forget to plug the hose though otherwise it will weaken the mixture!

Also check all the vac hoses for splits or leaks for the same reason.

Darren

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Jul 21^st, 2006, 8:52am

Dave/Darren. Thanks for that. I have followed your tips and having read your thread Dave I disconnected the battery for a couple of minutes,as stated, and having just taken the car for a quick run there does seem to be an improvement. Reading that link I wonder if the TPS has been confused as a result of opening the throttle wide in order to clean the carb and the butterflys?. Anyone got any views or experience of that?. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Dave on Jul 21^st, 2006, 9:23am

In the page about the tps it says that it could have gone out of synch with the ECU if the throttle were pressed while turning the ignition on.

I would think that exactly the same thing applies to cleaning the butterfly valves. Perhaps if the valves did not quite return to their natural position until the accelerator had been pressed once or twice then it would log an incorrect tps value.

Not got any personal experience of that to draw upon though, just my thoughts :)

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Jul 23^rd, 2006, 6:38am

A recent similar post (Idle problem 12v) mentions the 'adjustment' of the IACV by turning a screw in the end of the unit. I can see the screw mentioned but before tampering with it I wondered if anyone else had done so or had any views on the subject. I have never seen this referred to previously or is it just another quirk of the Scorpio that has remained un-discovered!!?

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Tompion on Jul 23^rd, 2006, 1:19pm

I suspect it's factory set - not intended for adjustment.
Having said that try a quarter turn or so either way and see if it helps (let it settle for a while between adjustment). As long as you keep a check on how far you turn it you can set it back as it was.
Don't screw it in too tight, it's a plastic screw & the head breaks easily.

Dave

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 7^th, 2006, 4:04pm

Gentlemen. I have had a scan. nothing found, I have today swopped the IACV with one from Shaun which was known to be ok, and the problem still exists, No sign of air leaks and all hoses sound with no signs of deterioration.Air filter, MAF,trunking ,all secure and clean ,throttle linkage free and butterflys' not sticking. Any more ideas please. Apart from this niggle the car runs well and returns 29mpg. (2ltr 16V).

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 9^th, 2006, 12:52pm

Help!!. Had a scan this morning at my friendly garage. Fault P0113 came up, Inlet Air tempSensor, High Input. Replaced sensor, £28 !!. No b.....y difference to idle problem. On reading the scan the Pre cat Sensor was reading between 60 and 900. The Post cat sensor was reading between 100 and 137. The EGR was showing a reading of 0.14v. Can anybody please make any sense of these figures?. By the way the quote for a new Pre cat sensor was £115 +vat!!.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by jonnycab on Sep 9^th, 2006, 1:23pm

Have you checked the wiring under the engine cover. Also the 2 plug leads, coil packs for damage & spark plugs. :)

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 9^th, 2006, 3:01pm

J/C. Yes have replaced the wiring through the head,all soldered etc, plugs,coil packs etc. checked and appear sound. Driving me nuts!!. Disconnected battery at lunchtime thus forcing a re-set but no significant change. Have since done 20+ miles of urban and fast main road but again no change. ??? ??? ???.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by scorpio_man on Sep 10^th, 2006, 9:46pm

hi mike

i take it the reading from the lambda is from 0 to 1 volt, so your reading seems fine. were you able to tell how fast it was switching? a replacement one (needs soldered in) costs about £30 (ford only sell rear ones now, afaik. different plug), from here (http://www.cats-direct-shop.co.uk/lambda-sensors.php)

not sure about egr reading. :-/

how's your a/c? when was it regassed? still think it's the idle valve, but hard to tell from a distance.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by tommy1340millar on Sep 11^th, 2006, 12:30am

also, check for cracked exhaust manifold - my 2.0 16v was doing the stall thing & surging, I needed a cat for mot, and the exhaust manifold was cracked. got it welded up. It was ok for a couple of months, but now I can hear either an exhaust blow or the manifold crack has reappeared, and the potential stalling has reappeared.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 11^th, 2006, 6:52am

Andrew/Tommy, I have changed the IACV with one from Shaun that was known to be working. When the scan was running the Pre cat sensor reading was changing rapidly between a reading of 60 and 900 whilst the post cat one was cycling between 100 and 137. Whatever those figures mean!!.The EGR showed a reading of 0.14v. I checked the exhaust manifold, which is a fairly new one, whilst checking the connections to the Egr etc. and that is sound. This (http://www.gendan.co.uk/product_LB1335.html) site sells direct replacement sensors apparently.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Snoopy on Sep 11^th, 2006, 7:07am

Mike try here for Sensors they are a Lot lot cheaper from here http://www.cats-direct-shop.co.uk/lambda-sensors.php

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 11^th, 2006, 7:11am

Thanks Dave, Thats the firm that Andrew put up the link for. Still hoping to hear from Eric who has the scans that Paul did. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Tompion on Sep 11^th, 2006, 10:25pm

Mike
The Gendan site says the 2.0 & 2.3 should have a planar sensor.
My 2.3 has a planar sensor fitted, which was on there when I bought the car.
You can read about the difference here:
http://www.superchevy.com/technical/engines_drivetrain/accessories_electronics/0407sc_bosch/

Dave

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 12^th, 2006, 6:56am

Dave, Thanks for that. The link you put up will be of interest to all those 'experts' and 'engine builders' we have out there I am sure. Gendan of course indicate that it is a direct replacement for the ones on our cars and that is no doubt why. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by scorpio197 on Sep 12^th, 2006, 7:28pm

I had an idle problem last week ,drove me nuts ,turned out to be a split pipe on the crank case breather .You cant see the thing its hidden under the heat sheilds and exhaust manifold ,just an idea it may help ...it took 3 ford main dealers to find the problem ....david

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Tompion on Sep 14^th, 2006, 1:19pm

Mike

I emailed Gendan the following:
I have a 2.3 Scorpio Y5A engine,
apart from the connector is their any difference between the universal
planar sensor & the direct fit one?

They replied:
The universal Planar sensor and direct-fit sensor for your car are both
built to the same specification. The only difference is that the direct-fit
is supplied with the Ford connector and correct wire length attached.

Dave
Oh the other difference they’re £30 cheaper!

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by the_machine on Sep 15^th, 2006, 1:06am

this happened to me and it was a coil pack (on my 2.3 ultima estate)

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 15^th, 2006, 7:21am

Thanks for that T-M. Was there any obvious sign of 'damage/arcing' on the coil pack as I have made a visual check without finding anything apparently amiss and of course nothing showed up on the scan. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by jonnycab on Sep 15^th, 2006, 9:50am

Does the engine seem to misfire on acceleration as well as bad idle. If so, then it may well be the coil packs.
I had a prob with misfire on acceleration which turned out to be coil packs, but there were no physical signs that they were shot. :)

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Sep 15^th, 2006, 7:45pm

Hi JC, I changed the coil packs and plug leads today and I must say there does seem to be a slight improvement. Have only done 15 miles (Pub and back!!) so I'll see what happens tomorrow when I will give it a longer run. Thanks everyone for your interest and advice. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Nov 4^th, 2006, 2:52pm

THANKS... .... to all those out there who offered advice. The result is that I today 'bit the bullet' bought a new IACV and the car is now running as sweet as a nut!!!!. I must say that Fordparts UK were very good. Mike.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by scorpio_man on Nov 4^th, 2006, 4:26pm

hi mike

good one! :)

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by cossieguy on Nov 4^th, 2006, 4:36pm

on 11/04/06 at 14:52:07, Simmo wrote:

How much was it from them?
Guy.

Title: Re: Idle problem.
Post by Simmo on Nov 4^th, 2006, 5:19pm

The total for the valve and gasket plus postage and vat was £80. Discount was 15%. Service first class. Just a point of interest, the unit for the 2.3 is different as is the gasket. they initially sent that one as it appears on the Ford system. Having e-mailed Trevor they sorted it by return. The 2.3 is 1058383 and the gaskets (Two rubber rings) 7090339. The 2.0ltr 16valve is 1063996 and the gasket, conventional, is 7165249.