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        General >> Problems >> Serious problem help
        
(Message started by: knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 12:47pm)

Title: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 12:47pm

Being a bit of a diy man (destroy it yoursellf) :-/ I have caused a major problem on my recently bought scorpio, I hope that someone out there csn help. after buying the car I discovered that the auto dimming rear view mirror had been glued into one position and it kept falling of. so in my infinate wisdom I bought a stick on one and cut the wire going to the mirror. after doing this and driving off I noticed I had no dash readout I.e not milage speed petrol anything also the lecky windows were not working, So I assumed I had blown a fuse no big deal I thought sort it when I get home, so carried onto bank and when I came back to the car it would not start. Called the wife out with a circuit tester and a boster starter but car would still not start and all fuses check out as ok. ended up having to be recovered. have still not fgured out what the problem is, the lights, indicators, radio, and wipers all still work but no dash instruments or lights work and it will click once when you try to start it and that is all. the battery is fine and as I said all fuses are ok. If anyone has any idea at all please let me know.

Cheers

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Simmo on Sep 26^th, 2006, 1:03pm

Are you getting a code from the PATS. ReadTHIS (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/pats.htm). And then go to THIS (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/pats.htm).

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by cossieguy on Sep 26^th, 2006, 1:12pm

I'm sorry to hear of your troubles, but, WHY did you cut the cables? The plug for the mirror sits just inside the roof lining,two minute job to get to and unplug. I suggest you do this in case you've somehow damaged the cables when cutting and their shorting(Unlikely i know!)but i assume you cut them right at headlining so 12v line might be shorting on chassis. Then disconnect battery and reconnect to clear fault memories etc and try turning her over.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Simmo on Sep 26^th, 2006, 1:20pm

The first two diagrams HERE (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/electrical/intbasic/MotorSlidingRoof.pdf) will show you how to access the plug.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Daven on Sep 26^th, 2006, 2:53pm

Does sound like the electronics fuses (16 and 17) in the central fusebox (not the one by the battery). ???

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by TiberiuS on Sep 26^th, 2006, 6:09pm

If the battery is ok and the fuses, there are only so many things which can throw down so many circuits at once.

I agree with Simmo regarding the PATS, if the starter relay is clicking when you turn the key there the relay circuit is working, there must be something immobilising the car.

How long have you owned it? Are you sure this isn't just a coincidence?

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 8:06pm

Hi All thanks for your replys, not sure on the pats system that you said about will try and check that tomorrow, have only had the car 2 days and think its too much of a coincidence to be a fault accord at the same time as cutting the wire and yes i know how daft I was and found the plug afterwards, had a garage look at it today and he said he had checked all the fuses and feed and it was beyound him and that he would have to send it to another auto electrician. I realy hope its nothing serious as although I have only had the car a short while i realy enjoy driving it. will keep you posted

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 8:09pm

just to say apoligies for spelling errors tend to type too fast and do not proof read, Does anyone have any idea were the wiring from the dimmer mirror goes too as it must be connected to the rest of the systems and am assuming it has blown a component somewhere along the line. and just to answer cossieguy yes I have dissconected it via the plug now so no short circuit can occur all be it a bit late ::)

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Simmo on Sep 26^th, 2006, 8:44pm

Although it says Sierra THIS (http://www.carsoft.ru/avtorepair/sierra_el.html) is the wiring diagram for the Scorpio

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by hellblue on Sep 26^th, 2006, 8:45pm

I had this,as said above its most likely a blown fuse in the drivers side fuse box a brown 7.5 amp one cant remember its no. though..

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Simmo on Sep 26^th, 2006, 8:48pm

As Daven says fuses 16 and 17 are listed as 7.5amps and they cover 'Electronics'

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 9:12pm

I have checked those fuses myself infact went through every single one of them on both sides with a circuit tester and alll checked out ok, thanks for the link to the wiring diagram not the best at reading those things hard to tell whats connected to what.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by TiberiuS on Sep 26^th, 2006, 9:21pm

Unfortunately I think you've just found the reason the previous onwer got rid of your car. It sounds like the immobiliser system to me, if you can hear the starter relay clicking then the low level electronics are working, something's stopping/inhibiting the high current getting to the starter.

When you turn the key to pos II, does the dash come to life, displays come on etc? Do you get full headlamps or just sidelights with the key there?

Anything like this may help pinpoint the fault.

Did you buy it from a dealer or private sale? the short time you've had it makes it reasonable to go back an complain.

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by hellblue on Sep 26^th, 2006, 9:24pm

PULL OUT the 7.5 amp fuses & look at them! make sure the wires you cut are not shorting to each other

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 9:49pm

HI again the dash is completly dead no matter where the key is. All the lights work side, main and h/beam as do indicators, radio and wipers. have pulled fuses and checked and the wires are definatly not shorting as I have removed the plug behind the nterior light that connected it. It was from a garage but not sure where I stand as it may be my fault.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by bizzay1 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 10:13pm

does it have a battery cover ??

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 26^th, 2006, 10:19pm

yes why?

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by TiberiuS on Sep 26^th, 2006, 10:28pm

Hey mate, I'd still take it back to them, cutting a wire to a mirror isn't ever going to do any more damage than a blown fuse. Besides, you haven't touched the car electrics at all, have you? ;). Chances are the garage knows full well the car has a problem, it's probably the reason it got sold but it doesn't make it a bad car either.

At this point it may be worth checking the state of the wiring looms in the engine bay, whether the fusebox is dry and also checking the multiplug connectors to the fusebox (details on another thread on here, can't find it at the moment).

Hope this helps, Bruce.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Simmo on Sep 27^th, 2006, 6:59am

on 09/26/06 at 22:13:32, bizzay1 wrote:

does it have a battery cover ??

The reason for the question is simply that the battery cover is essential to stop water getting into the fusebox on that side. These cars are renowned for problems if water gets into the electrics,particularly the fuse boxes. The lids themselves need to be properly secured and the drain holes from the battery tray into the engine bay need to be kept clear of leaves and other debris or water will build up under the boxes.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Daven on Sep 27^th, 2006, 7:32am

Looking at the schematics it looks like there are no other components (but I'm no expert at electronics), if the PATS check out ok I would disconnect the battery for 15mins (unless you already have) and the re-connect - also make sure the smaller cable is also connected to the battery.

You could also test the supply to the mirror to see if there is still power going to it - that will disprove it was something you did! ;)

Good luck

Dave

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 9:44am

The battery cover is a ok and have not had any rain since getting it a couple of days ago. the breakdown company have sent it to an autoelectrician hope to hear something by midday. will let u know what happens

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by LiverpaulH on Sep 27^th, 2006, 10:00am

I'd be honest if I was you I'd be going back to the garage if the auto eleccy can't help. You don't even need to say you cut the wire as you''ve now removed the plug.

Its very likely they'll be aware of the problem imo.

Paul

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by cossieguy on Sep 27^th, 2006, 10:05am

on 09/27/06 at 10:00:25, LiverpaulH wrote:

[] If you've only had the car 3 odd days then you're quite within your rights to go back and complain that the car wasn't fit for purpose. As we've seen on this and other sites you really have to stand up for yourself against unscrupolous (Spelling?) companies. They'll no doubt try and string it out to see if you lose interest, but DON'T.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by bizzay1 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 10:14am

on 09/27/06 at 10:05:07, cossieguy wrote:

am I missing something here, I'm not sure that this was purchased from a garage, and if bought privately I don't think it's an option of taking it back, as the previous owner will say no guarentees were given

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 10:17am

yes it was bought from a garage. I will wait and see what this auto elec guy says come lunch time and if it is a big job/problem I will be going back to them. Just like to say a big thank you to you all for all you help and suggestions. will let you know what the guy says when i here from him.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by bizzay1 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 10:18am

on 09/27/06 at 10:17:26, knights001 wrote:

Back it goes then !!

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 2:35pm

Hi again. Well all fixed, turns out by cutting the mirror wire I sent a back feed down the wire and caused a small fire behind the fuse box cusing some wires to fuse together hence why some things worked and others didn't, personaly I thought thats what fuses were there to prevent, oh well. anyhow it cost me £124 so a verry expensive mistake and one I will never repeat.
Got another problem now have found that if I am turning quite sharply at low speeds I just a juddering through the steering wheel as if the power steering is strugling. anyone got any ideas, also anyone got a scorpio mirror for sale.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by roger_howes on Sep 27^th, 2006, 3:28pm

Sounds like air in the power steering rack. Quite a common problem, especially if the front of the car has been jacked up with the front wheels not supported.

Get the front wheels on to gravel or grass (so you don't scrub the tyres more than you need) and turn from full lock one way to full lock the other way continuously 3 or 4 times.

That usually fixes it.

Roger.

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by knights001 on Sep 27^th, 2006, 3:48pm

thanks roger will give that a go and let u know.

Andy

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by Daven on Sep 27^th, 2006, 5:06pm

Glad it's sorted - good lesson to us all to disconnect the battery for any kind of work like this on the Scorpio ;)

Dave

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by cossieguy on Sep 27^th, 2006, 5:08pm

the steering shudder is a known problem on the Scorpio, a TSB (Technical service bulletin ) exists to replace some of the piping:
Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/faults.htm)

Title: Re: Serious problem help
Post by TiberiuS on Sep 27^th, 2006, 6:13pm

Hope you've sorted it, not often nowadays that fuses let wiring burn like that, sounds like the good ol' Ford days with the bayonet type fuseboxes which used to shake to bits and fill with water, ahhh...the good old days ;)

Bruce.