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        General >> Problems >> DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
        
(Message started by: dogma on Feb 28^th, 2007, 12:17am)

Title: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Feb 28^th, 2007, 12:17am

Has anybody had the following problems -
no heating and temp gadge moves but only stays on cold unless car is left running stationary for a while, i,e over cooling.
Also slow in acceloration as if not firing on all cylinders or like choke staying on. For a 2.9 i would expect it to go better than this, although i know they are not a sports car.
the air filter seems ok and the same with the plugs, little bit puzzled. :-/
Any help would be greatly appreciated

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Spannerdemon on Feb 28^th, 2007, 5:18am

If it's slow in acceleration then you definitely have a problem. The 12v 2.9 will out accelerate most other cars effortlessly, and should comfortably and easily exceed 120mph.

I have one of these models, and they can really shift. Believe me. I recently had a call from Dorchester Hospital to attend urgently following a very serious family accident. My Mum who is 90 had tripped and fallen, gashing her head open on the corner of a wall, and lost a huge amount of blood. She was very, very lucky to survive. She has now fully recovered.

My Scorp got me to the hospital scarily fast. Like in just over 70 minutes from Torquay. And that's all I'm saying M'lud!! ;D

I still have a gut feeling that your TPS is dodgy. (Ref your other posts recently). If your throttle isn't behaving, then you need to sort it out. Also check that your ECU pins aren't wet or damp. The ECU is in a tray under the glovebox. It just drops down after you undo the clip. You'll need a 10mm spanner/socket to remove the plug.

Ref cooling. If the car runs hot (normal heating) when stationary, then there isn't much wrong. Don't forget that in cold weather the amount of cold air passing through the front of the car, and around the engine (these are big engine bays), will certainly affect the heating. Changing the thermostat MAY help as the one in the car may well have been there for many years and have become inefficient.

You CAN test it by dangling it in water and checking the opening temperature, but as you've got to get it out to do this, personally, I'd change it for a new one rather than mess around. Then you'd KNOW it's OK. ;)

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Highlander on Feb 28^th, 2007, 8:12am

Cooling fans on permanantly?
Or the thermostat may be missing altogether ;)

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by pinto on Feb 28^th, 2007, 8:35am

I'd bet on the thermostat being faulty, and probably the most cost effective start to troubleshooting :)

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Feb 28^th, 2007, 2:37pm

Big thanks for your advice guys and spanner man,I hope your mum is on the mend :-[ Well I will be busy now lol so will report back from the field lol ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by mr._floppy on Feb 28^th, 2007, 5:09pm

My temp gauge needle hardly stirs itself from the blue either, I suspect the thermostat is stuck open.

I'm reluctant to replace it as the plastic housing bolts look very likely to snap, and , knowing my luck , leaving the remainder of the bolt in the block and making a 30min. job turn into a nightmare.

I'm a pessemist you know :(

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Feb 28^th, 2007, 5:48pm

Hi, I ordered a new throttle position sensor and thermostat from fords which should be ready for tomorow, no cheap tho, the whole lot comes to 68 pound, the thermostat costs 16 pound for your ref, will fit all parts hopefully tomorow and will let you know.
With regards to most bolts and nuts that look a bit iffy, a good squirt of WD40 should usuall help, even sometimes with the plastic ones. Will let you know how I get on, many thanks for all replys
jim ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by TiberiuS on Mar 1^st, 2007, 12:14am

Think yourself lucky, new TPS for my car cost me £140 alone, another £120 for the ISCV if I'd needed it ::)

Don't go into performance saloon territory, it'll cost you dear ;)

Hope you sort it mate :). I'm not convinced the TPS is at fault but I hope it works for you ;)

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by sector-9 on Mar 1^st, 2007, 6:39pm

The coolant gauge should get up to (and stay in) the white area after about 10 minutes driving. If it's not getting that far unless the car is stationary then I'd bet on a stuck or missing thermostat (assuming the gauge is working correctly) and that'd also explain the lack of heating. One way to tell would be to mask off the radiator with a large sheet of cardboard in front of it and see if that helps, the other is to compare the temperature of the radiator top hose with the heater matrix 'feed' hose as the car warms up - top hose should stay cool until the gauge shows well into the white area.

Darren

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 3:31am

Hi all, well i fitted a new TPS and a thermostat. The car seems to be running a little better although it some times seems to hold back on acceloration, other times she certainly shifts, ill put that down to age and milage. The temp gadge works a lot better now but, if it sits statioary for a while, and i then put heating on, it blow out warm air for a few seconds before then blowing cool, if the car is in motion i get cool air. Ill try and cover the front of the rad next, i know this was a common fault of the old black cabs once lol. ::)

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by jonnycab on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 3:58am

Sorry to be the bringer of bad tidings dogma....but it sounds as though your heater matrix may be blocked.....

.......changed thermostat but still blows cold at speed, quick blast of heat on tickover, then cold.........classic symptom I'm affraid mate :(

Put the blower on full & check the matrix inlet & outlet pipes...they should both be red hot. If the outlet pipe is cool or cold, then you have a blocked heater matrix :(

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 5:52am

oh great, ill exaust every angle before taking that sod out ha ha, must admit when i changed the thermostat the it was basically just water, dirty and very smelly at that so could very well be blocked, iv got a week off now so guess what ill be doing lol, thanks for your help tho, ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Spannerdemon on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 6:08am

Nice to see that someone else gets up early!! :D

You might get away with backflushing your cooling system, or by using a proprietary coolant system flushing compound from your accessory shop. Glad it's running a bit better anyway. When you replaced the TPS you should have disconnected and re-connected your battery again so that your ECU can re-set. Keep plugging away....... ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by harry.m1byt on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 9:12pm

It should warm up very quickly indeed. Mine is the fastest car I have ever had (of the many) to rise up to a stable engine temperature and the fastest to start producing interior heat. The gauge just rockets up to the mid point, then settles there.vYou can check the correct thermostat operation by simply feeling the top hose as the engine warms up from cold - it should stay cold, then suddenly heat up.

Your cooling system sounds as if it has suffered serious neglect. I'd take off a few hoses and give engine, radiator and especially the heater matrix and good flush out from both directions - hopefully it might just clear out the gunge.

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by wickedteen on Mar 2^nd, 2007, 9:17pm

mine was warming up quite nicely but only luke warm heater then going cold, turned out to be waterpump, is your pump getting noisy

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Mar 4^th, 2007, 6:15am

Hi guys, no water pump has only just been replaced, it heats up in allthe rite places, i,e the pipes so the only other thing it can be is the heater matrix is blocked, will give it a good flush out today and see what happens ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Snoopy on Mar 4^th, 2007, 8:00am

Try Flushing BACKWARDS and with HOT water if possible .

I well remember one person using that method very sucessfully.

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Spannerdemon on Mar 4^th, 2007, 8:32am

You say your water pump has been replaced recently ???

I wonder if whoever fitted it has fully bled the cooling system. Try the Jonnycab method, which is here somewhere, but I haven't got time to find it right now as I'm off to work in a minute.

You MAY well simply have a dirty great big air lock, and THAT will most certainly mess up your heating/cooling.

Worth a shot anyway. :D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Simmo on Mar 4^th, 2007, 9:11am

The now famous JC method is HERE] (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Problems;action=display;num=1142380998;start=15#15)

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Mar 5^th, 2007, 1:04am

Sounds like a good idea, if the wonderful britsh weather holds out ill try that tomorow, thanks for the advice ;D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by dogma on Mar 5^th, 2007, 7:25pm

Hi all, did as you said and this is what happened.
Drained water out of system, then refilled with a rad flush and left the car to idle for about 10 min }{.
Drained the system and the connected a hose to the top pipe entering the rad, and put hose on full blast, not much differance in the water, I then did this to the heater matrix hoses, straight away a nice blown water with some bits come out, left this for a few minutes, the did the entrances to the engine (where the matrix pipes connect) and more browns stuff. Once done I refilled with 50% coolant to water. After running for over 15 minutes I tried the heater, this time it was worse and cold air only, then, without warning a air bubble the size of france popped out the expansion tank and covered me in nice hot coolant :o, once I stopped screamimg I tried the heater again and this time I got a instant sun tan 8), wow when they work they work. So must have a been an air block from hell, and now the misses wont shut up cos its now to hot, no pleasing. Many many thanks for your advice. jim :D :D

Title: Re: DOUBLE TROUBLE PROBLEM
Post by Spannerdemon on Mar 5^th, 2007, 9:23pm

Quote:

now the misses wont shut up cos its now to hot, no pleasing

[] [] Never happy are they??

{} {} Nag Nag Nag }{ }{

Glad you've got it sorted!! Good result. ;D