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        General >> Problems >> NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrrr
        
(Message started by: grandadman on Sep 27^th, 2007, 8:14pm)

Title: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Sep 27^th, 2007, 8:14pm

Hi everyone, NEWBIE here, I have just bought a Ford Scorpio Cosworth 24V Ultima on an R plate.

Problem is I am freezing to death and winter's not here yet.
I have has a buzz around most of the controls but feel I've missed something obvious.

Can anyone help me with a possible solution to my lack of heating inside the vehicle

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Highlander on Sep 27^th, 2007, 8:49pm

Hello and welcome ;D

Heater controls are fairly easy so i'm assuming you've turned the heat on ok ;)
Is the blower fan running ok?

1. Check theres not an airlock in the heater pipes.
2. Check the heater pipes havent been bypassed or joined due to a leaking heater matrix (it takes a cowboy to know a cowboy) ;)
3. Blocked heater matrix? remove the hoses and flush it out
4. make sure the multiplug behind the heater controls hasnt come loose.

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Sep 27^th, 2007, 9:50pm

Thanx for your reply Highlander, are there any pics [relating to the heater matrix hoses etc] to assist my investigations on this site?
Cheers

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Highlander on Sep 27^th, 2007, 10:39pm

Heres the heater pipes going into the matrix through the bulkhead fig 10

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/interior/heater/HeaterAss.pdf

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Snoopy on Sep 28^th, 2007, 7:25am

First thngs first ... Before trying all of the above do a sysem reset on the heating/ coolin system which can be found HERE (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/ccreset.htm)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Sep 28^th, 2007, 11:49am

Hi Snoopy- Already I am overwhelmed by the help and access to technical manuals etc on this site,
Before I commence my work on the rectification of the problems with my Cossie I would
like to start by making a first donation to this Ford Sorpio website of £10.00
Would you please advise me of the beneficiary name at PayPal so I can send some
cash.
Cheers and thanks. You can send the Paypal id to me privately if you would prefer

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by scorpio_man on Sep 28^th, 2007, 12:22pm

on 09/28/07 at 11:49:33, grandadman wrote:

hi there

just follow the paypal link at the top of the page (don't worry about the name bit ;))

thanks for supporting the site. :)

andrew
forum admin team

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Sep 28^th, 2007, 9:30pm

Hi everyone you no doubt aware of the old guy and his "I DON'T BELIEVE IT" I am referring to Mr Victor Meldrew, well now I have just joined his clan and you won't believe this!!!
I bought this car about 10 days ago off eBay and I was told all engine fluids had been checked so, here we go...

I posted this query yesterday... "Hi everyone, NEWBIE here, I have just bought a Ford Scorpio Cosworth 24V Ultima on an R plate.

Problem is I am freezing to death and winter's not here yet.
I have has a buzz around most of the controls but feel I've missed something obvious.

"something obvious" were the operative words I HAD!!!

The car needed 7 litres of water after which the heat belted out - I have been lucky that I didn't lose the engine, having said that, the temp guage never at any time indicated there was an issue with coolant.

These cars are really marvellous :)

I have just got rid of my reliable Granny Scorpio M plate wherupon every day I just got in and drove it to wherever I wanted to go I had owned it for 2.5 years and looked after it so it made me a little complacent - I have now been woken up with a jolt and realise that other people dont care for their cars the way I have in the past!

A lesson learned :-[ and oh! thank you all for you input to my stupid dilemma ;)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Robiko on Sep 29^th, 2007, 1:41am

I have the same problem - Hi = cold; Lo = colder; a/c = colder still...thanks for the info Snoopy, I'll give it a try tomorrow, hopefully it will be that as I know there is heat coming through because occasionally I'll get a surprise blast of hot air before it reverts back to cold, and I'm loathe to start stripping the car this time of year to change the heater matrix...thank God for heated seats... ;)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by jonnycab on Sep 29^th, 2007, 8:22pm

Needed 7 litres of coolant :o....it must have been empty & you're lucky you didn't blow something ;)

...."the temp guage never at any time indicated there was an issue with coolant".... the temp guage will always read cold if there is no coolant in it, even if the engine is red hot. The temp guage sensor has to be emmersed in coolant to take a reading, so no water, no temp reading :)

Glad it was an easy fix though, changing that heater matrix is not a job for the faint hearted :)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Sep 29^th, 2007, 8:48pm

Thanks jonnycab - changing that heater matrix is not a job for the faint hearted - or an old Victor Meldrew character like me!

The fact that the guy sold me this car without water wants hanging up by his man parts!!
Seemed an intelligent guy, though THICK :o
I checked the coolant level this morning and it hasn't budged from the re-fill level which is brill news - and there is no signs of rusty water escape around the front of the engine so I might have got away with it!
The reason this lack of water was highlighted was that I happened to call in to a garage to get a price for fixing the exhaust leak [which turns out to be the left side manifold gasket] and my friendly mechanic observed a lot of noise in the area of the water pump which led him on to check the water level. 7 litres of water later he said "I think you would be better off leaving the car here and getting a taxi home" After some little time it was descided that there wasn't any water being lost and I could carefully drive home and return next Tuesday to have a new water pump fitted - but I now know through this really good club and some internet research that the pump this guy will be supplied is for an older model scorpio QCP2672 [can one include jpeg pics in these replies??]
I have since found a Scorpio Cosworth water pump since!
I have also booked the car in for a 'health check' at my local Ford garage Jennings of Washington Tyne & Wear who have this car in their data base! -- to be continued...

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by jonnycab on Sep 29^th, 2007, 11:52pm

Good luck Grandadman & hope you get the cossie running nice ;)

I can imagine your.... "A dont bil-ev-ett".... face, when you opened that bonnet & had a peek inside }{

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Robiko on Sep 30^th, 2007, 5:00am

Still no luck, reset the system and admittedly it's a little warmer than before, but only a little...(oh yes and I do have plenty of water in it ;) )...probably I'll reverse flush the whole system and see if I can clear some rubbish out of the matrix...

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Snoopy on Sep 30^th, 2007, 7:37am

In reply to grandadmanYES you can post pictures attached to the posting but they must be no bigger than 640x480 PLEASE and instead of using the quick reply box use the reply on the bottom of the message and you get all the icons for use . ie, pictures http://sc.groups.msn.com/tn/BD/D0/TheFordScorpio1995/43/387.jpg and quotes etc etc

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 1^st, 2007, 8:43pm

This has now been totally resolved - and shame on the previous owner running a Cosworth for days on end, without checking fluid levels, allowing the water coolant to go down to a dangerous level :(
Thanks Snoopy for the advise on inderting a pic.
I ordered all the parts from my Ford dealer today.

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Robiko on Oct 12^th, 2007, 9:36am

My problem has also been resolved, and strangely enough in a similar way to Grandadman...

Yesterday my Scorpio decided to have a minor hissy fit and dumped all her water on the ground, on closer examination the top hose had a four inch gash in it, now I've replaced it the heating now works, no more hot antifreeze smell, and finally no more window fogging... :)

Winter? Bring it on... ;)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 13^th, 2007, 10:40pm

I just received the parts water pump etc yesterday and today with the very pleasant mild October day found me working in the engine compartment stripping things down to remove a totally tired and worn out water pump - the play was about 2mm side-to-side no wonder the front end was extremely noisy! I also found that the cast steel base of the CC pump belt tensioner had broken in two at its base so that it'll have to be replaced. There must have been some enormous vibrations around the water pump area as a result of the bearing having gone. most of the 10 mil bolts were down to 5 or 6Nm very bad - but it made disassembly easy.
I made one big mistake of not removing the electric twin cooling fans and thats where I am at tonight , tomorrow I shall remove said fans and remove the worn out water pump then have a good old clean up in the area prior to fitting the new Ford part. to be cont/d
One thing worthy of note for the inexperienced - you need a hexagonal bit set with a H10 bit to remove the main driving belt tensioner and gain access to the two final left hand water pump securing 10mm bolts I think I wil do a start to finish on this issue perhaps for the site managers to put in the main hyperlinks to 'Fitting a new Water Pump' what do you think guys ?;)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by Highlander on Oct 15^th, 2007, 10:44pm

like this? :)

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/cooling/WaterPump24v.pdf

I've always managed with a 10mm socket and a 10mm open ender

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by yangi on Oct 16^th, 2007, 1:56pm

Hi Grandadman

Glad to hear you got sorted. Out of interest how much was the waterpump? Mine's started leaking from the seal and although a tin of 'Bars' has cut it down for now, want to get it replaced asap.

Also thinking of changing the thermostat at same time as having a few issues - are these available easily? Read somewhere of six month wait ::)

Cheers

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 16^th, 2007, 8:09pm

Hiya yangi
Water Pump £128.97 + VAT less my discount - I have been buying Ford parts at my garage since the Granny MK1 days then Granny MK2, then Granny Scorpio MK3 and now the Scorpio 24V Cossie. So my parts manager really looks ater me on the price with dealer discounts.
I phoned today and was told that the sensor is £15.23 + VAT and the thermostat is £46.89 + VAT. I hope that info helps you. It's a shame that there is very little aftermarket supplies for this particular Ford model :(
Finally, I got the impresssion that these were available still from Ford

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 16^th, 2007, 8:24pm

Hi Highlander thanks for the link - I think we may have a wire or two crossed here...
"One thing worthy of note for the inexperienced - you need a hexagonal bit set with a H10 bit to remove the main driving belt tensioner and gain access to the two final left hand water pump securing 10mm bolts " I was refering to the long bolt which holds the heavy spring loaded main drive belt tensioner pump/alt/ps pump the head on this is recessed into the assembly and has a FEMALE 10mm hex head so you need a small set of male hex adapters to use with a 10mm socket and a good powerful bar Recommended torque setting 44Nm. I was not referring to the small 10mm x 25mm bolts that hold the pump onto the timing cover. ;)

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 16^th, 2007, 8:47pm

I still have one little thing left to do and that is to re-fit the electric fans assembly I tried tonight but couldn't get down for obstructions, so tomorrow I will raise the car and offer it up from the bottom. Fingers X'd.
I started the engine for a short while tonight and WOW what a difference that little job has made to my car apart from a small exhaust gas leak NS Manifold the engine sounded like a little sewing machine - very gratifying :)
My next job is to replace the two front wishbone asemblies which were sited in my post "MOT
Advisory etc bla bla bla

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by yangi on Oct 17^th, 2007, 8:06pm

on 10/16/07 at 20:09:47, grandadman wrote:

Thanks Grandadman

Ordered Waterpump and Thermostat yesterday - got them today :o From Lifestyle Ford of Horsham (working down in Surrey at Mo) Very helpful and quick. Unfortunately I also need to replace the Temp Gauge Sensor (small single wired one) - but was told No Longer available :(

Does anybody here know if a similar one exists from another vehicle? Can't be that difficult as it just looks like a 10mm threaded Copper probe................ or am i being stupid in thinking something else would work ???

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 17^th, 2007, 8:51pm

Hiya yangi I will try and re-call some significant items whilst the fiiting of a water pump is still fresh in my mind.
1. Raise vehicle and secure with an axle stand as well as the jack, working from the top, remove the 2 x two pin plugs for connnection to the electrical cooling fans stow away tidily.
Remove the two 10mm nuts from each side of the assembly which will render the unit removeable - gently lift each side to free the clips which sit on the radiator and then carefully lower and remove the assembly from the lower part of the vehicle. Once done you can lower the vehicle.
2. Remove the spring loaded AC belt 2 x14mm hex bolts then the main drive belt tensioner -this requires a 10mm hex bit in a 10mm socket and is recessed. After you have removed the tensioners and the belts you are free to access all the 10mm bolts that hold the pump to the timing chain housing, it's then a very straight forward task of preparation for the joints for old to new then a reversal of the main points as set out here the FEMALE 10mm bolt requires a torque of 44Nm To accomodate the correct refitting of drive belts [NEW I recommend!] You turn the tensioners clockwise and then release when the belt is correctly in position.
Regarding the Temp Gauge Sender I am going off to my local scrapyard tomorrow so I will put that on my list.

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by yangi on Oct 20^th, 2007, 2:17pm

Hi Grandadman

Did you find anything good at the scrapyard?

Title: Re: NO HEATING 24V COSSIE Ultima - HELP! Brrrrrrrr
Post by grandadman on Oct 20^th, 2007, 6:04pm

Only a few bits of trim - the engine was a 2.9 V6 Cologne Scorpio Ultima early M reg
so yeah nothing of interest!!