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        General >> Problems >> Problems a plenty HELP please!!
        
(Message started by: T3rrorbyte on Oct 20^th, 2007, 8:19pm)

Title: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by T3rrorbyte on Oct 20^th, 2007, 8:19pm

Hi All
This is my first post on the forum so please bear with me :)

I have an N reg Scorpio 2.9 12v Ultima and like many that have frequented the forum it has gone through the mill. In the last 2.5 years it has spent more time at a garage than it has spent with us as home but let me start at the beginning.

The first major thing to happen was an overlooked leak in the coolant radiator which quickly escalated to a cooked lump and a cracked head, from what I have read here on the forum that’s quite an achievement ;D So 1 brand new Ford radiator and a 2nd hand 2.9 lump later its back on the road, YAY. Not for long, a mixture of odd things then followed from smoke/steam coming through the vents to random cutting out at idle. 1 AA guy in his infinite wisdom decides that breaking the original idle timing nipple off and setting the idle speed slightly higher so to stop it from cutting out was the way forward. Needless to say it didn’t work and so started the long repair process.

Fortunately we had a good mechanic who did all are car related work and did it on our drive. One day whilst working on it the flames shooting out the exhaust set fire to a rose bush (air/fuel mixture I hear you cry). It became apparent he was starting to run out of ideas and asked if he could take it to his workshop to continue working on it. So end of February 2005 it goes to his workshop where he discovers the fuse box’s had rusted through and the main wiring loom was well and truly cooked. The parts list mounts up like this 2 new fuse boxes both left and right, 1 2nd hand replacement main loom, 1 new MAF sensor, 2 new oxygen sensors and 1 new catalytic converter :o

Nearly a year later surely it must be fixed by now, no it has erratic running random stalling still but before completing his work our mechanic died (God rest his soul). So we get the car picked up and returned, with what seems like sniffing distance from getting our beloved Scorpio back on the road. A harem of mechanics and so called auto electricians try their hand at getting it back to full working order. More new parts including distributer cap, HT leads, spark plugs, ignition coil and a krypton tuning and it’s still not running ???

The final part in the Scorpio saga comes in March this year when we decide to give it one more throw of the dice and have the car sent to another auto electricians workshop. Feeling confident he can get it running the way it should we leave it in his capable hands. 5 months later and a bill to the tune of £700 for another MAF sensor, another 2 new oxygen sensors and labour I could drive the car home woohoo.

But it’s still not MOT/road worthy there are a hand full of faults and problems but with the aid of the Scorpio owners site and this great forum I have slowly worked through as much as I can, not being a mechanic I have gone as far as I can.

I have replaced the battery but the new one drain totally flat in under 2 weeks, the Speedo doesn’t work but the VSS gives a reading when using the Instrument Panel Reset and the needle moves when the key is turned for the first time with a new power sauce as well as a few other problems. So this is my plea for help to not let this wonderful car become another statistic and end up at the scrap yard. If someone local to Dorset with an OBD cable and some free time is willing to help me to fixes these final few niggly things I would be eternally grateful.

Thanks in advance
Ben

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by jonnycab on Oct 20^th, 2007, 8:28pm

Welcome to the site,

Have you checked the alternator output whilst engine is running ?...should be around 13.5 - 14 volts.

If it's any lower then that could be the reason for the battery going flat :)

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by Highlander on Oct 20^th, 2007, 8:30pm

hello and welcome..

You definitely have problems... none more so than having the MAF replaced twice because the 12v doesnt have one!!

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by Baz on Oct 20^th, 2007, 11:02pm

Ben,

where are you in the country? You may benefit from an OBD scan from a fellow member then at least that may show up something of a start point...

Baz

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by Highlander on Oct 20^th, 2007, 11:28pm

on 10/20/07 at 20:19:03, T3rrorbyte wrote:

If someone local to Dorset with an OBD cable and some free time is willing to help me

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by Snoopy on Oct 21^st, 2007, 8:21am

The 12v does NOT have a MAF !

It does sound as though the idle control valve is one of the biggest culprits. You need some one near to you who has one of the EEClV code readers or get the garage to run it through the star tester...

The fact the speedo does not work may well just be down to a connection problem on the dash board .. The instrument dials do come out as one unit and the connection can be checked there.

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by T3rrorbyte on Oct 21^st, 2007, 11:21am

Hi Guys

Well looks like a made a wee mistake with the MAF thingy, feeling like I had added insult to injury I double checked the mountain of paper work from all the repairs and it’s the MAP sensor we have had replaced twice ;D

The car now runs ok after a jump start but it’s just not up to MOT/road worthy standards. On top of everything else the engine bay seems be getting hotter than I remember it. I have tested the thermostat it works ok, the fans kick in and the temp gauge is reporting normal temp but the coolant tank too hot to touch.

One major job I have to do is replace the rocker cover gaskets and get 8 of the butterfly rocker cover washers as one unhelpful mechanic has lost them for us and has spread the remaining 8 across the 2 rocker covers using 8 alternative washers to fill in the gaps.

Can anyone give me an idea of how big a job that’s going to be? I am determined to get this car fixed :)

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by harry.m1byt on Oct 21^st, 2007, 12:10pm

The 12v doesn't use OBD it uses an older diagnostic system called EEC IV, with a basic tester called a Star Tester. This tester is as simple as a switch and a small bulb, where you can count the flashes of the lamp to carry out the diagnosis - this plugs into what is know as the OBD socket, located above a drop down flap in the roof of the coin drawer.

The description of the basic tester is on this site, just type 'STAR' into the site seach. I designed a slight improvement so it played a tone - its easier count tones, than watch a light flash. Then we found an even better way which displays the code in a LCD display. Around a dozen 12v owners got together to build these LCD code readers.

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by Snoopy on Oct 21^st, 2007, 12:53pm

Changing the rocker cover gaskets is a very easy DIY job although the left hand one ( Looking at the engine) is a little harder than the right. MOST Auto component suppliers will give you the right gaskets ( They are AFAIK the same as for the older 12v granada). the spreader washers will be fine with other washers in their place although you should be able to get some from the scrap yard, from a granada 12v . If the fans are cutting in and there are NO leaks the temperature of the water should be fine . They do run at quite a high temperature . You can also check it using the dash board diagnostics although it is logratham scale so 255 is cold and 0 is boiling .... A lot depends on ambient temps etc ... As long as you have no air locks then everything should be ok.

Good luck

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by howiedintheplace on Oct 21^st, 2007, 7:17pm

Rewind back to the engine install.
Are you sure that a Scorpio 2.9 was fitted.
& also has the timing been done correctly in service mode?

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by grandadman on Oct 23^rd, 2007, 6:25pm

Hi T3rrorbyte
If you need any parts I know where there is a V6 [Cologne] fitted engine in a Scorpio Ultima in my local scrapyard gathering dust and rust - just thought I let U know ;)

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by T3rrorbyte on Oct 24^th, 2007, 8:35am

Hi Guys

Does anyone one live near dorset with a "star tester" as I've spent a fair few grand on it in the last couple of years and really can't afford to have another auto elctrician look at it. I'm willing to do all the work my self with guidence of the owners site, i just need help to identify what needs doing :P

Well howiedintheplace i am as sure as i can be only going on what used to be in there, the picture of the 2.9 lump from here and what in the engine bay now. As for the Timing not sure if it was done in service mode, i did get it krypton tuned but it was done with the wrong oxygen sensors in so was as much use as a pogo stick in a swimming pool :-/

Cheers grandadman i may take you up on that i'll no doubt find there is something cruitial i need, possibley the rocker cover washers 8 of ;D

I will get under the hood this weekend and test the alternator to see if its the battery drain. Got all this enthusiasm but dunno what to do :)

Title: Re: Problems a plenty HELP please!!
Post by ChrisF on Oct 24^th, 2007, 5:31pm

You said back at the start that you had all manner of steam coming into the dash, this is an indication that the heater radiator is gone. Would account for your water problems.