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        General >> Problems >> mot failure (emissions)
        
(Message started by: frank.a on Aug 20^th, 2008, 6:34pm)

Title: mot failure (emissions)
Post by frank.a on Aug 20^th, 2008, 6:34pm

my 97 2000 16v failed its mot today on emissions.

can anyone point me in the right direction of what to
do next please . Frank

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by TiberiuS on Aug 20^th, 2008, 7:11pm

Hello Frank.

Some more info would help mate, take a look at the test sheet and post the levels of the CO, HC etc.

Most common thing would be lambda sensors but there's a thousand things which could cause high emissions, if you just start replacing stuff on chance basis it'll get expensive for you.

Any chance of getting the car OBD scanned? Whereabouts are you in the UK?

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by frank.a on Aug 20^th, 2008, 7:56pm

Thanks Bruce.

fast idle test
co 0.362 fail max limit 0.300

second fast idle test
co 0.372 fail max limit 0.300

those are only fails on the sheet . hope this helps ?

Frank

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by TiberiuS on Aug 20^th, 2008, 8:55pm

Hello Frank. Check your PMs, if you can post the result for hydrocarbons (HC) and lambda it will give the guys more idea what might be wrong.

Would happily do you an OBD scan but I'm miles from you in Essex. Getting it scanned would help find out what's wrong, could be something simple like coolant temp sensor, worn lambda sensor etc.

Hope this helps.

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by frank.a on Aug 20^th, 2008, 9:13pm

thank bruce sorry for messing you about with pms ;)

fast idle test
hc 54 pass max limit 200
lambda 0.999 pass max limit 1.090

second fast idle test
hc 50 pass max limit 200
lambda 0.998 pass max limit 1.090

im afraid this means nothing to me ! :o

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by kev2scorps on Aug 20^th, 2008, 9:21pm

Hi,

I had similar figures on my 2L 16V a couple of years ago. Ended up having to replace the catalytic converter.

Kev.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by Jonnycab on Aug 21^st, 2008, 2:34am

Have you tried injector/fuel system cleaner ?....It may help :).....Put it in the tank a week before the test so it can all run through ;)

Also, on the way to the test, take it for a decent drive & if you can, give it a bit of welly on the local arterial road to really warm the engine up. A nice hot engine has lower emissions than a cold engine ;)

Also, replace the air filter if it's dirty :)

Hope this helps :)

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by martin_rowe on Aug 21^st, 2008, 8:35am

emissions are good, looks like cat had not 'lit up' or cat is in poor condition, hard fast road test befor re check (70mph in 3rd gear if poss) got to get the cat purged & up to temp.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by frank.a on Aug 21^st, 2008, 2:36pm

thanks guys.

i did put a bottle of wynns clean burn emissions reducer
in the tank but it was only 2 days before the test.

i also had had the car on the motorway just before the test.

any idea of the prices for a cat (if i should need one ?)

cheers.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by TiberiuS on Aug 23^rd, 2008, 6:56pm

Hello Frank. I know a few people who've used cats direct (http://www.cats-direct-shop.co.uk/) but haven't used them myself, just mentioning.

If it was mine I'd probably also change the lambda sensor(s) while I was doing the cat just in case but it depends how much you want to spend. Changed the lambda on the Mondeo because it was getting a bit slow and it gained me about 6mpg.

Regards, Bruce.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by carmow on Aug 24^th, 2008, 11:14am

this might help.. Jan this year my 2.3 failed in a very similar way to yours, I took it back 3 times having heated the engine, added all manner of cleaners etc and was just .02 out but they still wouldn't pass it. I finnally took it to an independant Ford agent in desperation and although the test fee was double the car passed - what he told me was, that with ALL electrical items on (lights, heater, radio, etc etc ) the engine works harder and thus burns cleaner lowering the emissions, how well do you know your tester? Ask if he can try it and see what happens!

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by mr._floppy on Aug 25^th, 2008, 12:18am

As for warming up the engine for emissions testing. I believe the official line for MOT testers is to let the car idle till the radiator fans kick in.

Which, to me, is a reasonable indication that the engine is at operating temp.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by martin_rowe on Aug 26^th, 2008, 9:18am

that just means the coolant is up to temp, the 'cat' may take considerably longer, in fact it may be almost impossable to get a poisoned or contaminated cat up to the correct temp with out a hard road test, an emission reading of Llambda 1.00 mens the emissions are correct, so if Llambda is 1.00 & CO is over 0.3% it usually means all is ok, but indicates a cat fault, either u/s, contaminated or not up to temp.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by mr._floppy on Aug 26^th, 2008, 6:45pm

<<<< in fact it may be almost impossable to get a poisoned or contaminated cat up to the correct temp with out a hard road test >>>>

Which is a good enough reason to fail it then I'm afraid.

The Cat(s) should be fully operational at a reasonable time after start up and shouldn't really require a 30 min. thrash down the M6 at 100 mph to get it "heated up". :(

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by carmow on Aug 29^th, 2008, 9:31pm

I agree in principle with Mr Floppy, however, we are realists... our cars are available in some quarters for peanuts and to add the cost of a cat to the equation far too many Good cars would be scrapped. Lets keep them going any which way we can !

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by martin_rowe on Aug 30^th, 2008, 8:31am

Normally it takes a cat approx 2 miles to 'lite up', they will seldom get hot enough left ticking over, in fact will may cool don enough to stop working. even a new one. any vehicle that only travels short distances / low load will eventually poison the cat, hence a good hard road test.
correct when carrying out the emission test (bet test) it is acceptable to do it with a hot radiator (cooling fan cut in) but that deffinatly dose'nt mean the cat is hot enough, in real life many cats are replaced with out being faulty, or correct diagnosis carried out, check out how many cats some of the fast fits fit. but what do I know.

Title: Re: mot failure (emissions)
Post by frank.a on Aug 30^th, 2008, 12:47pm

Thanks for all the replies guys.

had a new cat fitted and it sailed through the
emissions test 0.002 CO

The old cat was broken to bits inside !

Once again thanks Frank