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        General >> Problems >> Car won't start
        
(Message started by: sierra20 on Feb 9^th, 2009, 6:30pm)

Title: Car won't start
Post by sierra20 on Feb 9^th, 2009, 6:30pm

I would really appreciate your help, my 12v tappets were really nosiey so i decided to have a look to see if someone had had a go at adjusting the clearences without realising that the car had hydraulic tappets, and it appeard that they had because the gaps measure correct to the pre cat versions of the engine, so i used the procedure on this link http://www.granada-and-scorpio-online.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16715&highlight=lifters.

i you can t view the link its this:
Valves overlapping --------------------Valves to adjust

No 5 cylinder ---------------------------No 1 cyl (in & ex)
No 3 cylinder ---------------------------No 4 cyl (in & ex)
No 6 cylinder ---------------------------No 2 cyl (in & ex)
No 1 cylinder ---------------------------No 5 cyl (in & ex)
No 4 cylinder ---------------------------No 3 cyl (in & ex)
No 2 cylinder ---------------------------No 6 cyl (in & ex)

With the engine in the correct position for the pair of valves to be adjusted,back off the adjusting screw until a large gap is obtained.Now screw it back in until the gap is just "0" without depressing the tappet.Finally turn the screw in one and a half turns,this will compress the tappet by about 2mm into its working position.Repeat the process,rotating the engine to its new position each time to get the next pair of valves "rocking".
On initial start up the tappets may "tap" for a few seconds until the hydraulics settle into the new position.

The problem is now the car wont start, the starter turns the engine but there is no sign of it firing, its like there is no compression at all, is it possible that the adjustments i have made has actually opened the valves instead of compressing the hydraulic tappet, so all the valves are open which is causing there to be no compression.

There are sparks at the plugs and the plugs have petrol on them so that side of it is ok
thanks in advance

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by wumpster on Feb 9^th, 2009, 6:52pm

sounds very much like the valves are not closing fully m8 some times just an engine flush can quiet then down as its some times a bit of muck in the hydro tappet stoping them workin prop

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by gozz on Feb 9^th, 2009, 7:50pm

sierra20.
12valve engines that have been neglected always end up with noisy broken lifters.The ultimate answer is to bite the bullet and fit a new set,unfortunately on that engine the heads must come off to extract the old tappets,and you would need a headgasket set,which for some reason are not cheap.The end result though,is amazing.Before you decide,do a compression and oil pressure test to ascertain whether or not it's worth doing.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by sierra20 on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:02pm

thanks for the advice, how do you do an oil compression test? also what are the factory setting for the rocker adjustment studs?

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by gozz on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:02pm

Further to my last,you should know by the speed at which the starter turns the engine,whether or not there is compression.The loom along rocker cover becomes very fragile with age,and even though you have a spark it may not be occurring at the right time.There are three signal wires wrapped together in a copper shield inside that loom,they go from the distributor to the ECU,and are well known for breaking down,thus sending false signals.I would have thought that you should have got some sort of an attempt at starting even with a few tight tappets.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by sierra20 on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:10pm

i think that i need to put the adjustments back to where they were, that can be the only reason for it not starting, then go down the route of replacing the tappets, but is there a set adjustment for the rocker screws that ford set them at from the factory?

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by gozz on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:12pm

sierra20.
I don't know the factory setting,but the lifters will take up a big clearance,obviously there is no clearance when they are full of oil.If you fit new ones without priming them first,a nominal clearance can be set to ensure that there is a clearance for a start,then wind the engine over with the plugs out for a while to prime them.Many mechanics don't bother,they start em straight up and let em fill that way,personally I don't.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by sierra20 on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:16pm

gozz
before i adjusted the clearences, there was consistant gaps on each valve according to the gaps set in the haynes manual for the pre cat non hydraulic tappet versions, so that cant be right can it?

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by joe-satch on Feb 9^th, 2009, 8:58pm

well as its a 12 valve..like mine.....first you have the in-ex order wrong....its 1 ex-in 2 ex-in 3 ex-in 4 in--ex 5 in-ex 6 in-ex...and like the others that have replied to you here....i would say that nearly all....if not all the valves are sitting open a little...as in my reply to you on the G-S-O site. :)

Title: Re: Car won't start
Post by sierra20 on Feb 11^th, 2009, 5:20pm

Found out my engine has been replaced at some point with an earlier engine so it has got the adjustable tappets not hyraulic ones that it should have so I set them to correct gap as they were to big when I first started playing with it and now almost all the tappet noise has gone!!!! Cant believe the difference.