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        General >> Problems >> Autobox headache
        
(Message started by: Jonnycab on May 1^st, 2009, 12:29am)

Title: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 1^st, 2009, 12:29am

Something bad had to happen sooner or later I suppose ::)

My autobox has just suddenly started refusing to select 2nd gear ???....Pulling off from stop in 'D', the box just stays in 1st, ease off the accelerator & it drops into 3rd....or pushing down on the accelerator when in 3rd & it drops straight into 1st >:(.....Put the box in ice mode & it seems to pull off fine in 2nd ???

The ATF is at the correct level, smells good & is an acceptable reddy/light brown colour with no bits on the dipstick. I've not checked the MAF yet (bit late), so could possibly be a cause :-/....Also, could a faulty TRS cause this problem ? :-/

Any advice or clues as to what's going wrong would be hugely appreciated ;)

Please, please, please don't let it be terminal :(

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by gozz on May 1^st, 2009, 8:02am

JC.
St George's day was last week ;) Is there a possibility that your shift problem could be a faulty shift switch,that big expensive looking thing on the left side of the transmission,they have been known to suffer from bad contacts.Talking as we all do about the MAF,on my return home from the FMD the other day,the transmission went into neutral by itself,the engine roared,I moved the stick down and it slammed into second,creeping home I was sure it was the end of the road for the box :( but yes you have guessed it,I cleaned the MAF and it resumed it's silky smoothness.Hope the foregoing gives you a little hope.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 1^st, 2009, 5:26pm

Right then, tried cleaning the MAF & even replaced it with a spare, but no difference :(

I may have mis-diagnosed the symptoms though :-/....Although at first it appeared that 2nd gear was not engaging, I'm now not certain it is actually a fault with 2nd gear.

I have noticed today that when I give it some welly the engine is over-revving, so it seems that the autobox may be slipping for some reason.

Spoke to an autobox specialist today & he says possibly a servo fault :-/ but won't know for sure until he's road tested it. So it's booked in tomorrow morning for a road test, so should know after that how much lighter my wallet is going to be :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by joe-satch on May 1^st, 2009, 8:12pm

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Simmo on May 1^st, 2009, 8:37pm

Good luck Jon. Keep us informed!. ;) Mike

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 3^rd, 2009, 1:13am

Update....had the car road tested this morning by an autobox specialist & his professional opinion is that the 2nd gear brake band has had it (hence the over-revving (slipping) when it's trying to select 2nd) :(....although he says, that as it happened so quick with no warning, then it could possibly be a servo problem :-/....but I could see in his eyes he was just trying to make me feel at ease with the latter theory.

It's booked in for Thursday & he said he won't know for defo until he drops the sump & has a good look. If it needs a new servo, then it can be done with the box in situ for about £80, but if it's the brake bands, then I'm looking at a £700 rebuild :(.......although, he said he may be able to adjust the bands to get a few more miles out of it.

But hang on....guess what I found today in my local motor factors.....THIS (http://www.lucasoil.co.uk/products.php?page=products&subpage=product&product=27)......miracle cure :D, or just more snake oil jollup gunge ? :-/

I've nothing to lose as the car is off the road, so what the hell....for £15.00, if it does what it says on the bottle, then I'm laughing...if it doesn't, then not too much lost :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by wojtekor on May 3^rd, 2009, 2:08am

hmmm might be worth a try... where can you get it? it says on this website that you have to buy a whole pallet ;)

let me know how it worked for you... i don't have a problem as serious as yours but it have a time to time leak/drip from under the seal. don't have time to sort it out and it's occasional and not bad... it says on the bottle that this magical liquid also sorts out seal leaks... ;)

if it will work in your case that it might also help me out ;)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 3^rd, 2009, 2:46am

I got a bottle from my local motor factors, but you can get it on Ebay as well :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by wojtekor on May 3^rd, 2009, 2:54am

just found it on ebay ;) let me know if it did the trick for u. if it really can fix an issue like yours then it shouldn't be a problem for it to fix my inconsistent leak ;)
after all it's harder to fix a worn gearbox then a leaking one ;)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Simmo on May 3^rd, 2009, 7:27am

Jon. They also do a product for steering racks which I used. It did work for a while so I guess it has to worth a try. Good luck, Mike.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by scorpio_man on May 3^rd, 2009, 9:40am

hi jon

just found this email from bill (stn) from 11/2003.......

Brake Bands shouldn't really need adjusting ..but of course
> not everything that is " supposed " to be ..actual IS .. The
> bands are a metal half ring mounted on a shaft .. and they
> " brake " the rotating " barrel " that holds the clutches ..to keep
> it simple .. obviously that can't be metal to metal so they have
> material on them as do the clutches ..and in turn wear in a similar
> way < not so much though > .. the premise that they shouldn't need
> adjusting is based on that if they do then they have lost material
> and therefore are contaminating ..as a clutch plate would be ..not
> entirely true as there is an amount of " wear and tear " and the
> adjusting nuts have also been known to work loose ..albeit very
> rarely .. the adjustment is relatively simple < on a ramp >..and
> whenever I have adjusted them < after say 80,000 miles or so ..
> it has made quite a difference to the changes < in terms of clonking
> into gear or " take up " ..if you like .. two adjusters .. find them
..side
> of gearbox ..slacken locknut ..finger tighten inner bolt until pressure
> is felt against the band ..unscrew one turn ..tighten locknut .. there
> are torques but the method i suggest will be quite enough to set the
> bands to notice any difference in gear changes and so on ..
> hope it's fairly clear ......... regards STN .......... Bill ...

hope it helps. as you've said, nothing really to lose now.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 3^rd, 2009, 10:32pm

Thanks for that Andy, I have had a good look & it's gonna be pretty difficult to get to the adjusters without removing the exhaust etc, but not impossible. I wonder if anyone on here has ever successfully adjusted the bands without removing the exhaust ? :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by holtneil on May 4^th, 2009, 6:39pm

hi i think its a cat off job ??? i have used lucas products before they are very good can you let me know how you get on cos my box is a bit ruff on gears i cleaned maf and no change was going to buy lucas gearbox oil but my wifes escort has just turned out to be a rite off so been to sort dealer out but still lost some money :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 5^th, 2009, 12:08am

Put the Lucas stuff in today & guess what ?....no difference ::).......it still slipping when it tries to select 2nd gear. I've not done many miles in it yet though, so maybe it takes a little while to work :-/....then again, it does say on the bottle 'Results Are Usually Immediate'.

But if it doesn't work, then that could mean good news. This stuff is supposed to coat worn autobox brake bands in a 'polymetric' film (whatever that is ? :-/) to stop slipping. The fact that it's still slipping could mean that there is nothing wrong with the brake bands & it's just a 2nd gear brake band servo problem.....which is a lot less costly than a rebuild.....

......I live in hope :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by chinton on May 5^th, 2009, 12:40pm

Hi all. Have a Scorpio 2.3 Ultima. Had trouble with autobox, kind of slipping drive/ overreving engine effect. Looked on this forum and tried cleaning the MAF senser and to my delight it worked. Thanks for all your help. I wish all problems were as easy as this to solve :D

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by scorpio_man on May 5^th, 2009, 1:03pm

on 05/05/09 at 12:40:43, chinton wrote:

I wish all problems were as easy as this to solve :D

don't we all!!!! ;D

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 7^th, 2009, 2:55pm

The problem is now fixed.....& only cost £97 :D

The '2nd shift band servo' seal had blown & it was losing oil pressure in 2nd gear which was causing the slipping. The guy fitted a new servo & all is fine again :D

Phew, what a relief :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by joe-satch on May 7^th, 2009, 3:08pm

:) :) :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by wojtekor on May 7^th, 2009, 3:18pm

good to hear that :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by scorpio_man on May 7^th, 2009, 4:27pm

hi jon

that's a brilliant result. :)

what was the name of the place you got it fixed?

might help other members. :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 7^th, 2009, 4:38pm

The place is called 'Thames Transmissions' in Canvey & they really are a genuinely friendly bunch of guys, who really do know what they're doing when it comes to autoboxes :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Simmo on May 8^th, 2009, 8:12am

Good result Jon. :D

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Ivan Pevnitsky on May 12^th, 2009, 10:13pm

Hi there. Could you say waht is servo? I am russian so don't understand some special terms. maybe you have a scheme or a picture?

I am asking because i'm having problems with my gearbox too. I'll try to send you photo of MAF sensor - because i cannot figure out if it's clear or not :) (I tried to "clear" the AMF but don't know if it was cleared after my manipulations :))

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Tompion on May 12^th, 2009, 10:25pm

Search for servo in this PDF:

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/autotrans/A4LDEoverhaul.pdf

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 13^th, 2009, 11:22am

Scroll half way down this page http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/autotrans/A4LDEDescript.pdf & there are 2 servos on the outside of box (numbers 10 &11). The guy replaced one of these, although I'm not sure which one :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Ivan Pevnitsky on May 13^th, 2009, 7:21pm

Thanks, i found what it is (and remembered that i really know it ;D)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Ivan Pevnitsky on May 16^th, 2009, 12:20pm

Today clened the MAF (the rear thin wire became shining, but the front one still left brown) Cleaned with this: http://www.liqui-moly.de/liquimoly/produktdb.nsf/id/e_4066.html
But the miracle didn't happen :) The gearbox still jumps sometimes, sometimes it doesn't swithc from 1-st gear (until I release the accelerator pedal for a second or two). Then on high revs it's switched to O/D off (the indicator on the panel becomes blinking). With this mode it runs smoothly, but it seems that it doesn't switch gears at ll (I thinks it drives on 3-rd. Slow start, then accelerating without any jumps)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by pinto on May 16^th, 2009, 7:43pm

OD light shouldnt flash - that indicates a problem ??? - if its disengaged, it should light up constantly

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Ivan Pevnitsky on May 17^th, 2009, 11:24pm

Yes. The O/D button works fine: when i press it, indicator lihgts up. press again - it goes off. But sometimes after high revs indicator becomes blinking and it seems car drives on 3-rd gear only (until I switch off/on ignition)
But when I start drivging pressing accelerator pedal, it doesn't shift from 1-st gear. It's not a kick-down press. It increases revs slowly, but doesn't switch to 2-nd gear - it can go up to 6000 (I din't dare to try more :)), untill I release the accelerator for 1-2 seconds (enough for revs to down to 2000-2500). Then when i press accelerator again, it switches to 2-nd gear.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Jonnycab on May 18^th, 2009, 1:03am

Ivan, I would get an autobox specialist to take a look at it because I don't think you are going to get a correct diagnoses unless you see a specialist. There are so many things that can go wrong with an autobox internally & externally that I think it's just too complicated an issue to solve online :)

Your problem does sound very much like mine & my O/D light started flashing when it over-revved in 1st trying to find 2nd & if you eased of the accelerator it would find 3rd.

Can you use the winter mode setting on the autobox & pull off in 2nd ?.....I could, but it would start slipping at just over 2000 rpm. If yours is the same then it could be a servo seal problem like mine, but I wouldn't like to say for certain, as I don't know enough about autoboxes to give a diagnoses.....Even a specialist couldn't really give a diagnoses until he has at least driven it & had a look :)

Good luck ;)...... :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Ivan Pevnitsky on May 21^st, 2009, 7:54pm

Heh. I already took "specialist" year ago when my car stopped to drive forward. Hi fixed it, but not completely - I was able to drive again, but the revs jump, and gears are shifted as I told above (gearbox repairing is very-very expensive here).
He told me that the problem is in the valve body: the temperature causes it to curve a little, and then vavles stuck. But i'm afraid he just don't know the reason.
There're several companies here that offer autogeabox repairing, but the price is toooo-tooo high (you won't believe, but it's about £2000, yes - 2 thousand). That's why I'm trying to find another way. If there were any way to get gearbox from your country. I tried it with Highlander, but the bureaucracy doesn't make it easy >:(

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by Highlander on May 21^st, 2009, 10:10pm

They think i'm trying to send a bomb by t he looks of it!! :)

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by gozz on May 21^st, 2009, 11:37pm

Ivan.
Bureaucracy is a special description of something to bu--er every normal logical person about.It was invented by persons with nothing better to do,and makes a lot of jobs for them,it is now exacerbated by nonsense pouring in from some strange land called Europe.
Eire is now completely ruined by it,and all that amazing Irish logic is being dashed,as even the Paddys are finding they must toe the Euroline.
We in the funeral trade are being threatened that the traditional shouldering of coffins will have to stop,and we must wheel them.Some brainy geezers somewhere are plotting all this out,and suddenly it will become law >:(
What a load of old cobblers eh ?
This of course has little to do with autoboxes,but is still a headache ::)
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by jenko_15 on May 29^th, 2009, 12:49pm

Having similar problems with my 24v. When driving from cold everything is OK - speedo working, gearchange smooth etc. After about 3-4 miles, the speedo will stop working, the "O/D OFF" light will flash constantly and it goes into 3 speed mode with the changes very "cluncky". If I complete my journey and the car is idle for the rest of the day, then the same will happen as from cold. However, if I break the journey for say 30mins, when I start again the speedo still not working as above, but it will stick in 1st gear. Moving it manually into 2nd is smooth and then back into D and it is very "cluncky" again. :(
Any suggestions will be very welcome ineed. BTW - have cleaned the MAF.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by scorpio_man on May 29^th, 2009, 1:47pm

on 05/29/09 at 12:49:09, jenko_15 wrote:

hi and welcome

have a read of the replies to the thread.
http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Problems;action=display;num=1242751425

that's where i'd start with. at least check the condition of the multi-plug for the gearbox speed sensor.

hth

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by jenko_15 on May 29^th, 2009, 4:22pm

Will do - thanks. I'll let you know the outcome.

Title: Re: Autobox headache
Post by tlundkvi on Jun 16^th, 2009, 6:57am

Jenko, are your cat heatshields in place? Since I have the same problems and no heatshields...