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        General >> Problems >> ABS light staying on
        
(Message started by: lleewar on Aug 25^th, 2009, 10:27am)

Title: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Aug 25^th, 2009, 10:27am

My '95 2.0 ultima has the wretched abs light coming on at the 12-15 mph speeds. >:( I have removed the sensors from the back and cleaned them as they were covered in so much crap it was unbelievable.
Question 1. Do you clean the sensor ring and how do you do it ??
I have tried to remove the front sensors but to no avail so I need to clean them in situ. They look dirty on the face.
Question 2. What is the best way to clean the face of the sensor ( no compressor available here) and what with?
The front sensor rings I have read should have a plastic cone covering them but mine does not have them so the rings look quite dirty.
Question 3. What do you clean the sensor rings with, especially the face of the cogs? Your invaluable help would be much appreciated.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tompion on Aug 25^th, 2009, 11:24am

Front sensors are usually rusted in and best left alone if they don’t move easily.

It’s between the teeth of the sensor rings & the face of the sensors that need attention.
You should be able to get a bit of rag between the sensor & sensor ring & turn the wheel to clean the faces of the front sensors.
Sensor rings need to be free from magnetic particles, so just scrapping out loose dirt & loose rust with a bit of stiff wire should be fine –. Some WD40 usually helps shift it. You don’t need to worry about surface rust unless it’s flaking.
You can look down through the rear sensor hole to see what the rear rings are like – slowly turn the hub & look at each tooth gap. Usually you can just poke a bit of wire down & clear any loose stuff.

If you need to give the rear rings a good clean you can unbolt the hub carrier and pull it out just far enough to brush the rings – no need to undo the centre drive shaft nut.

Fit some front caps to help protect the bearing seals.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by gozz on Aug 25^th, 2009, 9:18pm

llewar.
The usual cause of your problem is the deterioration of soldered joints in the module under the ABS unit,particularly the two under the motor plug socket.
Tompion is au fait with this problem as well ;)
GOZZ.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 9^th, 2009, 5:30pm

Where is the abs controller that needs the solder repair? Is also called the modulator? I have cleaned the sensors back and front to no avail as the light still stays on after the 15mph run.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by scorpio_man on Sep 9^th, 2009, 6:41pm

hi there

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/abscontrollerrepair.htm

hth

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 10^th, 2009, 1:33pm

Thanks Gozz and Scorpio man. Will attempt the repair and post my findings, hopefully with good news.
Lee

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 13^th, 2009, 2:58pm

Hi guys, need to make sure i have the correct part in my hand. I have just removed the black box from underneath the abs pump and it says controller 95GB-2C013-AC Anti Lock Brake. I only ask as the controller in the repair guide looks different from the one I have.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tompion on Sep 13^th, 2009, 6:43pm

If it has a plug like this:

http://i.imgur.com/vyCsC2E.jpg

it is the earlier type, assuming it's the solder on the pins at fault you can repair it just the same. The pins will be on the opposite side to the motor plug.
I can post a picture of where to drill a hole if you want.

Dave

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tompion on Sep 13^th, 2009, 6:56pm

Take a look at this thread, I posted a picture there:

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Advice;action=display;num=1223490176;start=8#8

By the way (assuming you've not disconnected the brake lines) for testing purposes you don't have to fit the controller to the pump block - you only need to plug in the motor & the multiplug.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 13^th, 2009, 10:27pm

Hi Dave, Thanks for the info. I have the older type controller and cut a hole above the motor plug pins with a stanley knife ( did not trust myself drilling a hole in it), followed the instructions and resoldered the joints. Could not tell 100% if they actually needed doing but did them anyway and reconnected it all back together. Did not know it could be checked without the pump block connected. Will take car out in the morning to check how things went. Will post tomorrow.. Lee

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 13^th, 2009, 11:46pm

Hi Dave, Had to go and get my daughter from her night out and with hesitation turned the car over. All lights went out except, you've guessed it, the abs light. I drove off and after a hundred yards or so, hey presto, the ABS LIGHT WENT OUT and has stayed out!!!!! I am so relieved and elated. It also completely proves and advocates the repair scenario as fool proof, even to a novice like me who admittedly was worried that it might not work. I am totally thankful for the forum and it's members for their invaluable help and advice. As soon as financially possible, out of work at the moment, I will contribute to the great cause that is the Ford Scorpio1995+ club. Lee

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Jonnycab on Sep 14^th, 2009, 12:41am

One thing that has always bothered me about these joints that need re-soldering is......

.....Why do they go bad ?.....moisture ?, it's a sealed unit ???.......overheating ?, Hmm :-/

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tompion on Sep 14^th, 2009, 1:42am

I think it's vibration & flexing of the case. The pins are fitted solidly in the case but the board appears to be less rigidly mounted. Had they used wires between the board & the motor plug instead of long solid brass pins I doubt there would be a problem.
The pins for the multiplug are similar but much thinner, I assume they can flex & are therefore less prone to trouble.

They have a one way valve – lets air out, not in (in theory).
The board is covered in mastic & the solder generally is nice & clean beneath it, but look closely with an eyeglass & you can usually see a dull grey ring around the broken joint – I think this is from the pins fretting as the joints fail, similar to the red dust you’ll sometimes see around a bolt that isn’t tight.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by gozz on Sep 14^th, 2009, 7:49am

llewar.
Well done,perseverance is the way 8) the light does stay on initially after working on the system,similarly if you have had one rear wheel turning without the other as in working on propshaft or hub,but resumes normal when everything IS normal.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by amigafan2003 on Sep 14^th, 2009, 11:27am

lleewar - how easy was it to get the module out? Any tips for anyone doing it in future?

I might have to do mine if the fault returns and I really don't want to have to start disconnecting brake lines and all the associated bleeding afterwards.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Simmo on Sep 14^th, 2009, 12:34pm

If yours is the 'old style' with the controller underneath rather than on the front the access is from underneath. The mounting frame is held on to the fos wing and you need to remove the wheel arch liner in order to access the fittings. Once you have done that there is enough 'flexibility' to get to the underside of the unit in order to remove the screws holding it to the 'hydraulic' section. Gozz says you can do it without getting underneath and one day I'm going to get him to show me...and others... how he does it!!. :D
The procedure is detailed Here (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/absmodulator.htm) with pictures. ;)

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Sep 14^th, 2009, 1:42pm

Amigafan2003/Simmo, I followed the procedure given on the forum step by step AND did it all from above the car. I must admit that the screws to disconnect the controller from the pump block were very difficult to undo. There is not that much "flexibility", especially the one at the bulkhead end. I don't know how Gozz managed it but I used a T20 and a pair of adjustables to remove the screws and the rest is history. Patience is the word I would use but it can be done as this was my first time. The instructions are precise and easy to follow. More should attempt it .

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Simmo on Sep 14^th, 2009, 2:23pm

lleewar. I can only admire your patience and dexterity!. As you say it is the access to the two torx screws that is the real problem and frankly I had enough problems even when releasing the carrier as indicated!. :D

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by amigafan2003 on Sep 14^th, 2009, 5:35pm

Thanks for the advice - that was exactly what I was looking for.

Lets hope I never have to put it to use ;-)

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Oct 19^th, 2009, 1:58pm

Hello. I changed left front hub and now abs light comes very often... Is it easy to replace abs sensor? How to do it ? If i take abs sensor from old hub and replace it...

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Oct 19^th, 2009, 3:03pm

You do not need to remove the brake pipes, only the controller underneath the abs pump. Go to the forum page on "ABS Modulator" and follow the diagrams and repair procedure. The only difficult part is removing the two Torx screws that holds the controller onto the pump, there is not a lot of room to work, especially the one nearest the bulkhead!! I did it by using a small mirror to establish exactly where they were. I then held the bit while using a adjustable spanner to undo them. Once cracked they are easy to remove. In the repair of the controller itself, it is suggested that you drill a hole in the base below the plug using a stand drill and a 20mm bit. As I do not have one and was a bit dubious of drilling a hole and causing some damage without one, I carefully and patiently used a stanley knife to cut a hole big enough, but not too big, to work in with a soldering iron. I even used the part I cut out to replace it back where it came from and used some epoxy glue to put it back in place!! I was apprehensive about doing it, but I learnt from the experience with the forums help.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Oct 19^th, 2009, 5:48pm

The front abs sensors are the most difficult to get out as they usually rust in. More often than not, they break. If you can get the sensor out from the old one and the replacement hub , then it might work, but be careful. Soak in wd40 well before attempting the sensor removal. Try the old hub first Lee

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Nov 4^th, 2009, 11:33am

How do you get sensor out? Plastic just sits against the metal part of wheel hub. Doesnt move anywhere ???

Should I twist it or just pull it straight out ?

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tompion on Nov 4^th, 2009, 12:00pm

In theory they pull out.
In practice they rust in and won’t move.
Try soaking in penetrating oil.
Some people say they had to drill them out.

They will twist, but may not survive.
Rather depends if it’s a good one or a duff one as to how much force you apply.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by gozz on Nov 4^th, 2009, 12:00pm

Tekno.
The front sensors are always corroded in,you have to bust em out!!In view of that it's favourite to change the hub and carrier AFTER first testing the sensor.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tons_of_fun on Nov 4^th, 2009, 12:42pm

When i did my sensors i squirted WD40 all around it , every day for a week prior to changing. Still took me an absolute age to get the old ones out. LOTS of gentle wiggling ::) ;D

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Nov 4^th, 2009, 1:11pm

I managed to turn it 45 degrees anticlockwise and also 45 degrees clockwise. Is that good thing ;D

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Nov 4^th, 2009, 5:18pm

it may just be the plastic cover turning, not the sensor itself. As Tons of Fun says, give it a real soaking over a period of time.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Nov 5^th, 2009, 1:38pm

Plastic part detached but sensor is still in the hub. Wires are broken now ::)

How do I measure abs sensors?

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Nov 14^th, 2009, 3:25pm

front sensors = 1k ohm.

Where is connectors for rear sensors?

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by lleewar on Nov 14^th, 2009, 3:51pm

Hi Tekno Connectors for rear sensors under rear seat. Lee

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Nov 28^th, 2009, 2:33pm

Is is possible to check with OBD where faulty sensor is ?

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by tlundkvi on Nov 28^th, 2009, 2:58pm

on 11/28/09 at 14:33:51, Tekno wrote:

Is is possible to check with OBD where faulty sensor is ?

I think it should show up if the ODB software and lead supports it. I don't think it works with the "generic" odb mode.

Title: Re: ABS light staying on
Post by Tekno on Dec 8^th, 2009, 11:28am

Just measured rear sensors. They are both very close to 1kohm. Do you know how much resistance can vary without affecting ? I remember front sensor had something like 800ohm left and 950 right.