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        General >> Problems >> Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
        
(Message started by: mondeoman on Aug 30^th, 2009, 10:46am)

Title: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by mondeoman on Aug 30^th, 2009, 10:46am

Hi,

I've just bought an M reg Scorpio Ultima and for some strange reason the overdrive and cruise control lights are very dim. I thought at first the bulbs must have blown and was going to replace them, but in fact they are working just very faintly. Does anybody have any ideas what could be causing the problem and how best to solve it?

The traction control light, indicators, airbag, ABS lights are all working fine are are bright.

Many Thanks,

Simon

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by tlundkvi on Aug 30^th, 2009, 12:27pm

Do you mean those around on the meter assembly? If that's so, they might have blown and been replaced with the wrong wattage. (I assume they are hose twist on bulbs). New ones should be pennies from Ford, but to replace them you will need to remove fascia with stereo etc.

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/fasciabulbs.htm

If they are leds (not 100% sure), leds die over time and fade out, much more tricky to replace as you have to investigate a bit to get the correct led.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by mondeoman on Aug 30^th, 2009, 5:08pm

No the warning lights are located bottom left of the instrument panel.
I did wonder if someone changed the bulbs for the wrong wattage, but I have a full service record for the car (not just dealer stamps) and no mention of bulb changes etc in the service information.

I just want to be sure I'm not wasting my time stripping the fascia to find out all is well and it's something else.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Aug 30^th, 2009, 6:34pm

Small bulbs: T5 W2X4.6 1,2W 12V
Bigger bulbs: T10 W3W 3W 12V

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Geoff_W on Aug 30^th, 2009, 10:19pm

Any other strange electrical symptoms?

If not, may just be worth changing when you can. It is quite a job but the second or third times get much easier. If you are going ahead then change all the bulbs. Nothing worse than changing a bulb because it has failed to find the others failing shortly after.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by mondeoman on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:13am

That was my thoughts exactly. For the cost of a few pounds for all the bulbs I agree I'll change them all.

I'm not convinced though that it is simply a few wrong wattage bulbs that's the cause of the problem. I have just noticed that the O/D light which appears to be very dim whilst driving can be brighter at times, if the car is stationary when I press the button. :-/

Does anybody have any ideas how long I should allow for the job, considering this will be my first time at doing this?

Any advice on the best way to remove the climate control unit without damaging any of the plastic etc? A screwdriver my damage the components?

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:14am

I used two thin screwdrivers to pop it out

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by lesterlad on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:34am

Mondeoman:
Just a thought here, on my old 1991 Granada the orange cruise control light dimmed automatically when the lights were switched on.

Not having cruise on my Scorpio I can't really check this out.

So in essence, using cc in daylight = bright light, using it during dark & lights on = dim light, therefore reducing glare from the dash, maybe this would apply also to the overdrive light.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Geoff_W on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:44am

I used two old and expired credit cards ;D

Another thought to check, a number of dash warning lights dim when you switch on your lamps/headlamps, Cruise is one that comes to mind, do you see that change? (Great minds Lesterlad)

If not have a look at the Multi plug that the headlamp switch plugs into, if you see evidence of heat on one of the corners (two or three terminals) then you may be seeing the early stages of a problem that will drop your Sidelights, instrument lights, clock and radio lights.

Quite easily sorted if caught early enough. Its a big socket with a number of functions and some times if a little loose causes arcing (hence the melting). Simply pushing to make a better connection can do the trick or if you are a little late you can solder the two or three connectors.

Incidentally if my memory serves me well you will be unplugging it anyway in the early stages of taking out the instrument console.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by mondeoman on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:58am

I always drive with my head lights so hopefully people stand a better chance of seeing me. It's from my days of riding a motorcycle. The good news is that's I've just tried the cruise and overdrive without my lights on and both indicator lights are bright!

You have saved me a lot of effort stripping down the dash for no reason, thanks!

Just wonder why it doesn't mention this in the manual?

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Geoff_W on Aug 31^st, 2009, 11:36am

Undocumented feature ;) On my mk1 Scorpio there is an instrument dimmer, but apparently a rheostat would effect other aspects of the smart electrics on our Scorpios. ::)

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by gozz on Aug 31^st, 2009, 10:38pm

Mondeoman.
I think the information lamps are all LEDs.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Aug 31^st, 2009, 11:33pm

There seems to be T5 bulbs for O/D, Cruise, Traction Control. One for each.

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/8770/dsc04912.th.jpg (http://img525.imageshack.us/i/dsc04912.jpg/)

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by mondeoman on Sep 3^rd, 2009, 5:55am

I wonder why we are not able to service the other warning lights like the ABS etc which appear to be covered on the back where they are located?

Does that mean when they go I'm broken and need a new dash??

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by tlundkvi on Sep 3^rd, 2009, 9:24am

on 09/03/09 at 05:55:32, mondeoman wrote:

No, you should open the assembly and re-solder new leds to it, if they burn out.

The problem is you can't know exactly what type of led it is until you open it up and test. There's many different ones in use without even touching the meter, e.g:

Yellow 12V 5mm (not 100% on the size) (heated windows buttons)
Green 12V 3mm (e.g. mode switch)
Green 3-3.5V 3mm (e.g. seat memory)
Green 5V 3mm (wide button in seat memory)
Green 5V 3mm (window buttons)
SMD PLCC2 surface mount Green 3V & Yellow 2V 20mA (AC panel push buttons)

They can all be replaced and all types (except for the 5V green, but you can replace the resistor to the right one easily) are available from electronics shops. First figure out the type (form factor), then the color. Test with a low voltage 2V for yellow, 3 for green. If very dim, increase voltage in small increments. If they fade out or change colour, they were given too much voltage.

Ideally, you measure the voltage while the leds are connected from their pins.

Replacing the leds is quite easy to do with newbie electronics skills. It may not be worth it if you get a new meter for a tenner or so.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Sep 4^th, 2009, 12:56pm

on 09/03/09 at 05:55:32, mondeoman wrote:

I wonder why we are not able to service the other warning lights like the ABS etc which appear to be covered on the back where they are located?

Simple. That is to prevent cheating at MOT tests... (You cant unplug the bulb if ABS or Airbag is faulty)

ABS or Airbag warning light blinks/continuously on = FAIL at MOT

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by lesterlad on Sep 4^th, 2009, 5:20pm

on 09/04/09 at 12:56:13, Tekno wrote:

Simple. That is to prevent cheating at MOT tests... (You cant unplug the bulb if ABS or Airbag is faulty)

ABS or Airbag warning light blinks/continuously on = FAIL at MOT

Airbag not working is not a fail in the uk MOT

Well it wasn't last year.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Sep 4^th, 2009, 5:24pm

in Finland it is. :-[

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by Tekno on Sep 6^th, 2009, 8:54pm

I changed my dash bulbs. There wasn't any blown bulbs but still, WHAT A DIFFERENCE, huh! I recommend changing dimmed bulbs to new ones.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by magnetono59 on Sep 8^th, 2009, 12:54pm

Any suggestions as to where the bulbs for the instrument cluster be purchased.

Title: Re: Dim lights on dash board, any ideas?
Post by tlundkvi on Sep 8^th, 2009, 1:28pm

on 09/08/09 at 12:54:30, magnetono59 wrote:

Any suggestions as to where the bulbs for the instrument cluster be purchased.

At local factors or Ford for pennies a piece. Check prev. post by Tekno for sizes.