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        General >> Problems >> Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
        
(Message started by: n880eua on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:15pm)

Title: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by n880eua on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:15pm

I am the proud owner of a 1996 2.9 V6 12V Ultima Saloon. I bought it for a song to replace my old and jaded 800.

However I have one very serious issue with it. For some reason the gearbox seems slow. I know the car is heavy but my 820 was an auto and that was a rocket compeared to my Scorpio.

It goes up and down the gearbox fine but when you push the pedal to the floor you can feel the kickdown notch but the gearbox does not change down and pick up. If anything it changes down one gear and picks up slightly. It does this hot or cold.

Now I have looked through the hand book and it says about a green relay in the glovebox fusebox to do with speed. But there is only a yellow one and then a blank and then a blue one. But there is a socket there with 5 pins which is empty.

The gearbox is fine in forward and reverse and is silient and smooth excpet for the lack of kick down.

Any help would be great. Other issues I have with the car have been sorted by a great ebay seller who deals with Scorpio parts but the gearbox fault is a mystery to me.

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by tootman318 on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:23pm

could be kickdown relay fault. not sure of colour of relay

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Dave2302 on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:25pm

The 12v uses a different gearbox control system to all other scorpios. Your 12v has an external kickdown solenoid on the side of the box, the most likely culprit. It could be faulty or need adjustment. Failing that, there is a switch on the throttle cable which detects full throttle, maybe the cable adjustment or a duff switch. Also check the wiring and plugs to these components, maybe even a fuse. If all else is correct with the gearchanges I doubt it is a transmission fault, most likely one of the above.

HTH Dave

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by n880eua on Nov 18^th, 2009, 6:55pm

Thanks people.

I suppose in the short term I could just continue to use the gearbox like a manuel with no clutch as thats what I have to do to overtake.

The person I have been speaking to off Ebay seems to think the 12v is a little slow. Because I said with the car at 50mph it takes 10 secounds to get to 70mph with my foot on the floor.

Thats what leads me to suspect an issue with it.

Has anybody got any pictures or diagrams to invistigate the above and abubody know if I should have a green relay in the glovebox or not.

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by tonyboy on Nov 18^th, 2009, 8:21pm

Is there a kick down switch under the pedal, maybe thats sticking or the car mat is covering it......

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by gozz on Nov 18^th, 2009, 8:23pm

The green relay is for the cruise control where fitted. Not connected to the transmission.As Dave says,the operating switch for the kickdown solenoid is integrated in the accelerator cable,and is spring loaded to operate at full stretch of the cable.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Snoopy on Nov 19^th, 2009, 7:42am

The Kickdown switch on the 12v is on the side of the gear box read what dave 2302 says and he used to work on them He IS a gear box mechanic..... The soleniod might need adjusting Para 18 on this page and the subsequent pages might help you http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/manual/autotrans/A4LDeV612V.pdf
Paragraph 48 tells you how to adjust it !

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Nunnspoet on Nov 19^th, 2009, 8:23am

I've had my 12valve for 4 years though it is only a Ghia. However I seem to remember similar slugishness when I first got her and I believe that I solved the problem by re-adjusting the throtle cable. It is easy to do thought I can't remember exactly how ::), but the instructions are in the Site.

Check that there is nothing obstructing the operation of the accelorator pedal as I believe the kickdown is situated under the pedal unlike the 24valve.

I must say that my 12 valve goes like a rocket ;). It really is fast and very responsive, especially from a standing start (no Traction Control fitted?) and the kickdown is excellent ;D

Just been out to check the kickdown and it is under the accelorater. I also discovered that the Bty. is flat >:(. Not to worry I still love that car 8)

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by gozz on Nov 19^th, 2009, 8:49am

At the risk of appearing argumentative,as some may know I have,and still do,operate many 12v funeral hearses and limousines.Without exception they have the kickdown switch bolted to the side of the intake plenum,the accelerator cable operates this switch at full throttle since it runs through the switch.On the left side of the transmission is a solenoid with a thin cable attached to the kickdown lever.
This solenoid is energised by the kickdown switch at full throttle.
The foregoing is more or less what Dave said,and he is of course,quite correct.
GOZZ.

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by n880eua on Nov 19^th, 2009, 8:51am

Thanks people.

Well the car is going in for a fresh MOT tommrow so got a service to do on it first and a thermostat to change as its stuck open.

How easy is it to test the switch and replace the solonoid on the gearbox. I also have cruise control but no green relay in the glovebox and it works fine.

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Nunnspoet on Nov 19^th, 2009, 9:28am

Ooops :-[. Sorry Goz and Dave. I stand corrected. I was completely wrong and hope that I have not misled anybody. Your prompt response Goz should have seen to that, for which I am also gratefull.

Mike :)

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Nunnspoet on Nov 19^th, 2009, 9:47am

??? On the day I atain "Full Member" status I make my biggest gaff :-[. Took me back to the day I started work at Rose Forgrove Engineering in Gainsborough some 45 Years ago when I went to the stores for a "Glass Hammer". Just goes to show that I ain't learnt much.

Ah well Keeeeeep Scorpying

Mike ;) :) :)

Title: Re: Auto Box Problem & Other Minor Issues
Post by Dave2302 on Nov 19^th, 2009, 11:54am

Not to worry Mike we all drop the odd clanger ;)

Yeah Gozz is spot on. To test / adjust the switch, you need an assistant. Un plug it at the plenum end of throttle cable, put a meter or test light across the terminals and get assistant, (preferably a scantily clad blonde) ;D, to floor the throttle and hold it there. The switch should light the lamp/show reading on meter.

Also you should see the switch slide closed, if it doesn't tighten the cable. Once you look at it it should be obvious how it works.

It often goes un noticed as these boxes use the vacuum modulator to downshift and it's only at full throttle that they should shift down 2 gears depending of course upon road speed and load......As you say at 50mph it should drop to 2nd when you floor the throttle, and take off like a scalded moggy :).

In my experience of this problem I always check the switch first, cos its easy, but I have found more often than not it's the solenoid on the side of the gearbox.
See the link from Snoopy above.

HTH Regards Dave

HTH Dave