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        General >> Problems >> Cossie losing water
        
(Message started by: Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 3:28pm)

Title: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 3:28pm

Hi I am supposed to pick up a 96 2.9 24v scorpio estate next week and have just received this email.

I took the machine out on Saturday just to do a little shopping and it appeared to use a lot of water. I know this is thirsty weather but a litre just to go about 5 miles is a completely new development. It used only to get through that much in a month.

I have no idea where it is going. It only happens when travelling. Nothing is used when the vehicle is stationary. This worries me. I don’t want you to have to drive around with a tank on the roof! Pls let me know what you think. Usual suspects of course: Hoses, rad, pump, gasket.

Has anyone any idea what the problem could be? It does seem odd that it only uses water when moving? I have never had anything like this happen on my 2.0 16v.

Thanks Andy

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Simmo on Jul 15^th, 2013, 4:33pm

Andy, the point about stationary needs clarifying. Does he/she mean with the engine running or switched off. If it has been using water on a monthly basis has something now finally given up the ghost?. Has the engine and gearbox oil been checked?. A litre in five miles running would seem to indicate that it's being pumped out under pressure possibly once the 'stat opens?.

As you are looking at a Cosworth you should also look at This page (http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/autogearbox.htm). Go to the penultimate paragraph and then go to the highlighted link. (Gearbox oil cooling). :)

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 4:41pm

Hi Simmo I have sent him a mail asking your questions. In the meantime he says that on inspection one of the belts looks perished yet he has only done a 1,000 miles since it had a major service so still a bit odd lol.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 4:44pm

Sorry went blind for a moment lol. it has only done a few k since the major service so maybe they did something to it.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 5:10pm

ok it seems he didn't have the engine running when it didn't loose water lol. He says until then he lost a pint every 800 miles or so.

as for the belt he wrote this.

Picture of Simon Dipper

It’s the big one (the wide one) on the off-side i.e. the one on the left as you are looking into the bonnet from the front.

if this helps as the 2 things could be connected and I only know the 2 litre engine.

Could it be that this belt had a piece break off and damage a hose?

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Matt on Jul 15^th, 2013, 6:15pm

Hey

it could be a number of issues, can he see any moisture under the car when parked up that would indicate a location?

places it could be leaking are:

the rad (know for ballooning)

the hose that goes under the near side head

The hose under the fat one from the rad to the Y shaped ali bit, ive seen there get rubbed through from the belt if its stretched or the tensioner is flapping about.

Radiator drain plug, mine leaks here, the rubber washer has perished.

Oil cooler, seen the hoes get damaged / melted by the exhaust if the retaining clips have broke.

water pump

steel pipe between the V corroded.

to lose that much water there will be some sign of it. if hes been topping up with anti freeze then there will be a crystallized mess around the area

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 15^th, 2013, 8:02pm

Looks like I will have to wait till I go and get it then. Can we get all the pipes mentioned? And if so where can I get them? As I want to rebuild the car I might as well start there. Also source a 2 litre rad to swap over.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by leewar on Jul 15^th, 2013, 10:47pm

I've got a 2.0L rad if you need one Andy.Cheers Lee

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Glyn on Jul 16^th, 2013, 1:32am

Had same problem with one of my 24v's-using water but no obvious cause. Carried on for 14 months until the water pump seal gave way massively. No previous clues, no leak on standing and pump not suspected because it was a new genuine ford one -no refund "over 12 months"! Another new pump and problem solved.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Simmo on Jul 16^th, 2013, 7:04am

on 07/15/13 at 22:47:02, leewar wrote:

I've got a 2.0L rad if you need one Andy.Cheers Lee

Is it disguised as a central heating rad Lee? ;D :-X

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Technology2005 on Jul 16^th, 2013, 11:08am

;D

Thats a better place for him to hide it than in his prehistoric burial mound..... ::)

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 16^th, 2013, 5:09pm

PM sent Lee thanks

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 20^th, 2013, 1:08pm

I have now been told there was no steam coming out of the exhaust and no water in the oil or auto box oil but wonder if the water pump gasket might have gone or the heater matrix.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Scorpio on Jul 20^th, 2013, 1:42pm

Also, check the expansion tank/bottle integrity. Seen them leak under pressure. Have someone increase the revs gradually whilst you watch for leaks.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 20^th, 2013, 2:22pm

It is a bit hard getting info at the moment but I will go over all the things said here with a fine tooth comb when I get down there on Thursday thanks

Title: Re: Cossie losing water and now stutterin
Post by Andycan on Jul 27^th, 2013, 1:42pm

Ok I think I found the culprit the water pump is making a rumbling sound so I assume the bearings are not very well and all around the pump gasket on the engine is wet so I assume that is the leak and that I need to replace the pump and gaskets.
Another problem that has cropped up is whilst testing it on pulling away I kicked down and she started to pull away nicely then started to stutter and die and I lost the rev counter any idea's what this might be?
Thanks Andy

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 27^th, 2013, 3:43pm

Oh I forgot when it was stuttering and dying there was a load of smoke comming out of the exhaust yet I took my foot off the peddle and then put it back down again and it was back to normal and no smoke.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by amigafan2003 on Jul 27^th, 2013, 6:25pm

That last one sounds like it's going super rich - the rev counter is driven from the alternator so if the engine slows or stumbles could be affected.

I'd get a code reader on it - but it could be a dodgy coil pack or simply a dirty MAF.

I reconmend http://www.burtonpower.com/water-pump-cosworth-v6-24v-2-9-bob-epw01.html for a pump. But get the gasket http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Scorpio-Cosworth-2-9-24-Valve-BOB-code-water-pump-gasket-1994-to-1998-/281018905041?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&fits=Model%3AScorpio&hash=item416e0831d1 as it's better quality than the paper gasket - just be aware it will weep the first time the car is started up after fitting until it's got hot and sealed properly - don't panic (like I did!).

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 27^th, 2013, 7:00pm

Ok thank you I shall have to see if Stixy has a reader.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Tompion on Jul 27^th, 2013, 7:17pm

The rev counter is driven from the edis on the 24v

See under 3. pulses in the table at the bottom of this page:

http://www.fordscorpio.co.uk/instreset.htm

"engine speed signal coming from the alternator, (12V V6, 2.5 TDi) or the EDIS (all others)"

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by amigafan2003 on Jul 27^th, 2013, 7:49pm

Doh!

In that case, defiinately looking at an ignition related fault then. I'd put money on a duff coil pack.

Title: Re: Cossie losing water
Post by Andycan on Jul 27^th, 2013, 8:48pm

Ty Tompion